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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 5:05am (Reply to #5551)
Spartacus Rex
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Hey Cal, Did You Finally Finish "Jekyll Island" Yet?

California Lawyer wrote:

Most interesting debate, my friends.

It is not always so simple, is it?

Actually it is, if one knows what they are doing.

Each one of us has a choice.

Right, and then there is the law. Don't leave that out. wink

Personally, the system they have given us is corrupt to begin with. Fiat currency is a fraud.

Since day one back in 1913

The tax system is a fraud.

Not entirely.

There is NO legitimate way to reconcile the revenue laws with the US Constitution.

Sure there is. One simply needs to grasp the limits of the revenue laws and actually comprehend the U.S. Constitution

One must file a tax return, and sign it under penalty of perjury.

Objection! Assumes facts not in evidence.

And any officer of the Court and/or any other public fiduciary who wishes to cling to that B.S., I am willing to put same on the witness stand under oath and expose their ignorance, thus unfit for office in short order.

 Yet, one cannot be compelled to confess a crime.

Guess what? One cannot be compelled to be a victim of Fraud either! wink

Hence, there is inherent conflict, and one version is correct, the other is not.

You do comprehend the limits of jurisdiction, correct?

So, if the Constitution is the supreme law of the land, then the revenue code cannot mandate disclosure.

Sure it can. Your trouble apparently is that you do not grasp the difference between the term "Income" and a Citizen's earnings, let alone the distinction between an actual Citizen, and a mere gov't created legal fiction such as corporations, and public fiduciaries such as their officers

Hence, a tax return must be voluntary.

It is 100% "voluntary", the Commissioner of Internal Revenue even states so. However should any of those subordinate to same fail to pay assessment, see how fast it takes whereby such will lose any benefit of a gov't granted License or Privilege to exist and conduct commerce, or how long it takes the IRS to collect said assessment via third parties.

 Yet, try that one and one ends up in federal prison.

Funny, I believe Debtors' Prisons were abolished in the U.S., and far be it for any JD actually familiar with the U.S. Constitution not to pick up on that lack of any "enforcement" clause included in the 16th Amendment, ratified by the several States, thus delegating same, as was done in both prior and subsequent Amendments, but you already know: "Ignorance of the law excuses no one/ is no excuse."

Payment of taxes, based on fiat currency, is a giant fraud.

Agreed. However 12 USC 411 is "supreme Law of the Land" as well, and did anyone otherwise teach you that the meaining of word "shall" contained therein has any other context than Mandatory?

Perhaps you would care to dazzle everyone by correctly identifying the specific section under the IRC (Title 26) which provides the massive write off available to those who actually follow 12 USC 411 in the same year that they receive any fiat FRNs, thus eliminating any "Income" tax liability, or any requirement to even file for that matter?

... There is no catch-all that works for everyone, except the original Constitution, that has, sadly, been confined to the dust bin of history, while the fascists control us now.

Use it or lose it. wink

The only way to keep out of the cross hairs is to become one of them, or to avoid the system altogether.

Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence. laugh

My dad's best friend growing up, refused to pay taxes. He has never paid them, ever. He just kept moving around, eventually ending up in Alaska.

He eventually did a deal with the IRS, paid them nothing, and that was that. BUT, he gets NO social security.

Excellent. Nothing is more pathetic than a card carrying Socialist / Serf anyhow.

Hey Cal, how about you review 301 U.S. 548 and see if you can pick out that huge clue concerning Socialist Security that the U.S. Supreme Ct. made obvious therein. Or better yet, dazzle us by pointing out which part of Privacy Act of 1974 mysteriously failed to subsequently find itself codified under Title 5

My view is a bit more pragmatic. Since the system is built upon fraud, then recognizing such fraud, calling it out, and calling it what it is, then grudgingly admitting to partaking of its benefits, mandates my payment of something back towards the system. Hence, I pay back the fraud with their own fraudulent scrips of paper. They get theirs, and I do what I do. If one looks hard enough, there are plenty of escape valves that do not require one to exist within the system.

Again completely voluntary, and 12 USC 411 is still law of the land to lawfully reduce one's taxes

But why do some classes of folks get a pass while others face penalties and prison?

Ignorance of the law, obviously.

That is the real immorality.

That's right, because ignorance of the law excuses no one, as it is no excuse.

It's been that way for millennia and is not about to change anytime soon. wink

Cheers,

S. Rex

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 7:04am (Reply to #5558)
SilveryBlue
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@Ruffian You are thinking like me

I also have a will to do something collective and supportive in spirit.

You are right that there are a lot of people who are starting to feel the need for community.

You might want to have a think long & hard before inviting people to share with you - on a lease basis or a buy in basis or other arrangement. Also have a think about the values that should be the starting point for any agreements.

Many years ago I met some folks who had a fledgling -how to describe- Commercial commune. They didn't want people who donated their worldlies in order to join and would have to walk away empty handed if things didn't work out for whatever reason. They wanted people who could do stuff to buy into their property & agree to live as a community. When I met them they were (from memory - it's been a while) looking for a brewer, a baker & a horticulturist to add to the 3-4 families they already had growing gardens & sheep. You had to be able to do something for the community to be considered. The idea was if you don't want to stay, find someone to buy you out if the community couldn't/wouldn't.

They were building cheap as houses out of shipping crates faced with the local riverstone. The small houses they already had up looked kinda old worldy & fit in perfectly with the local scenery. It was beautiful. I do wonder how it worked out for them.

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 2:02pm
Mr. Fix
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A supportive collective…

I love waking up to a fascinating discussion in progress, it keeps the wheels turning in my brain all day long.

A couple of years ago one Turdite member who goes by the name "Gold Dog" proposed building a community of Turdites loosely based on the concept of "Gaults Gulch", a fictional community based on the novel "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand.

"Gold Dog", as a man of considerable means, proposed buying a large track of land, for the purpose of such a project.

There is currently one underway in Chile, a self sustained community based on the concept of maximum liberty for its inhabitants. The term "going Gault" describes the intent to separate oneself from the system, on the basis that those who contribute the most to society are having the most stolen from them by their government. The only way to break the cycle, is to stop contributing. This inevitably ushers in a collapse of the system, which is the intended goal.

Many discussions ensued on exactly how such a collective would be governed, and many problems were discussed.

From my perspective, property rights are a key essential ingredient, as systems based on communism simply do not work.

Ruffian, 

The way I read your posts last night, your desire to build a community of like-minded people, might be mutually exclusive to your desire to maintain your privacy. 

Occasionally, my goals seem to have inherent conflicts. A song from a generation before yours comes to mind, as I found it to be a source of inspiration at that particular point in my life. It's probably worth the 3 1/2 minutes to listen:

Vienna waits for you

Some times more than a day or two maybe required, but the concept remains.

 Approximately 10 years ago, the town in which I live tried to impose a draconian takeover of the water rights in my small hamlet which is a subdivision of our town. Being built out of what was once a summer only community there was a system in place to provide water, but only during the summer.

Over the years, most residents provided for themselves, by getting their own wells drilled, so that they could maintain their homes year-round. Out of approximately 1000 residents, there were only four homes left without wells when the state declared that the town could not provide water anymore that was unfit for human consumption. The town withheld the four permits for wells under the pretense that there were already too many, and that the additional runoff might pollute the water supply. Of course, this was completely nonsensical, and it quickly became apparent that the town was engaging in a blatant power grab. They proposed a town water supply that would cost at least $50 million to construct, cost the residence at least $10,000 a piece to connect to, then the water would be metered, and charged for by the gallon, and of course, all private wells would be outlawed.

This created a monumental hullabaloo as 1000 angry residents were pitted against the four who were in favor of town water. One elderly man got up and gave a speech at a town hall meeting with a sob story of how he's been waiting for town water for 30 years. Many speeches focused on the on feasibility of running pipes in a mountain that was made primarily out of granite, which is why pipes were never buried there in the first place.

No arguments against the town takeover seemed to have any effect whatsoever on the town Council, as all of their arguments were based on what was required for "the greater good". The fact that there plan would cost more than anyone in the town could afford wasn't particularly relevant, and the idiocy of withholding 4 well permits seemed to escape everyone.

In front of 1000 families, and the town board, I got up and gave a speech off the top of my head which outlined the criminal nature of the town board, and the blatant theft inherent in a system in which are Hamlet had no say. I then announced my candidacy for mayor of my Hamlet, and that we would be seceding from the town.

I explained that my platform would be to ban all taxes paid to the town, and an instant granting of the well permits, which would be irrelevant in my administration, since everyone would have the right to do as they please with their own property. We would not be held hostage any longer. The town hall exploded with applause and cheering, as a look of horror replaced the look of smugness on the faces of the town Council.

I had found the only legal loophole in their grand scheme. The four well drilling permits were issued immediately.

Since that time, they've been incrementally raising taxes to justify outlandish spending, none of it in my Hamlet. I know in my heart that if I took such a succession movement seriously, it could be done. The local town board is universally hated by the residents in my Hamlet, and by placing tax liens on dozens of homes, they are stealing them for section 8 housing. Everyone knows it, but no one is doing anything about it. I think it is time to build a real community.

In my situation, the vast majority of residents own their homes, but still except a completely tyrannical dictatorship bankrupting them through taxes, and a code enforcement system similar to the one that NW VIEW outlined in a post yesterday. Permits to do anything in our Hamlet easily cost far more then the materials and labor to actually do it.

It is an Agenda 21 town to its core.

The town school board is also a cesspool of corruption, and our school system is nothing but an money-laundering operation that warehouses children for 13 years to indoctrinate them, while simultaneously making them too learning impaired to ever be a useful member of society upon graduation. The only education that remains is outside the system.

Creating a Community school is the most problematic aspect of my plan, and I will probably need a bit of help with it.

All efforts to fix our society's problems will have to start first at the individual level, and work outward to the local level.

I have a basic plan and a basic strategy, and about 1000 like-minded families who are willing to go along with it. I have abstained from pursuing such a goal until my daughter left town, because I do expect substantial blowback.

Spartacus Rex,

that's an interesting post on taxation, but I do not claim to be an authority on such matters. I have read such a wide ranging spectrum on what is legal, and what is not, that I can only assume that it is lawless to its core.

My philosophy is simple, I refuse to comply. How I have gone about that, is to the best of my ability, and knowledge.

It's time for me to call an end to my brief sabbatical, and gear up for my return voyage to New York.

There's no place like home.

"When the student is ready, the teacher will appear."
Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 2:33pm
ag1969
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'Production Versus Plunder'

Here are some of the imperial edicts that empowered and unified Christianity as a single doctrine and established it as a single organization which was part of the Empire: 313 – Imperial subsidies to be given to the catholic priests of North Africa. In addition, those who are seducing the catholic Christians of North Africa need to be corrected. 313 – All catholic clergy are free from compulsory public service. (These compulsory public services were taxes paid in the form of labor.) 318 – Constantine gives Christians the right to take their cases before an ecclesiastical court rather than a secular court. The ruling of those bishops will carry the same authority as a secular court. 343 – Clergy and their servants shall not have to pay any taxes, or any new taxes in the future, nor shall they have to quarter strangers, and they shall be tax exempt if they start their own businesses. 349 – Clergy are exempted from all compulsory public services and municipal duties. Their sons should continue in the clergy unless obligated by service in the Senate. 355 – Bishops shall not have to appear before secular judges; accusations against them shall be brought before other bishops. 394 – Heretics are forbidden to teach their doctrines or appoint priests or other clergy. Judges and other officials must enforce this law. 395 – All pagan festival days are declared non-holidays. No one is permitted to perform a pagan sacrifice. 395 – Anyone who disagrees with the Catholic Christian Church even on a minor point of doctrine is considered a heretic. 396 – Local leaders and officials are not to be selected from the Alexandrian craft-guildsmen unless they are Christians. 398 – Eunomians and Montanists (non-conformist Christians) are to be expelled from the cities, and if they reside in the country and hold assemblies, they are to be deported and the owners of the land punished. Heretical books are to be destroyed. Those who refuse to surrender such books are to suffer capital punishment on the charge of sorcery. 408 – Laws in place against Donatists, Manichaeans and other non-conformist groups remain effective. Prosecution against them must continue vigorously. 409 – Only orthodox Christians may be appointed as defender of a city, with the bishop and clergy joining the distinguished citizens in making the appointment. 412 – Anyone who hides a Pelagian (non-conformists, again) will suffer the same penalties as a Pelagian. St. Augustine is authorized to publicize the penalties for Pelagians. 425 – No spectacles in honor of the emperor are to take precedence over worship of God. It can be seen from this list that the Empire made great efforts to establish the church not only as a state religion, but as a secular power as well. ("Secular" means pertaining to worldly things. Secular power is governmental power.) This development was erratic but especially powerful under Theodosius II (emperor from 408 to 450), who seems to have finished the job with a great deal of violence. This distribution of power to approved Christians only created further problems within Christianity by inducing Christians to fight for position. When proper doctrine is rewarded with money and power, these are the things that people fight over. Once such battles are underway, the only thing that can stop them is a central strongman that cannot be overcome. This was probably the driving force behind the papacy, which was alien to Christianity before this time. -

See more at: https://www.thedailybell.com/editorials/36422/Paul-Rosenberg-Production-...

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 4:53pm
ag1969
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U.S. Government Releases Document Details Of Extraterrestrials

With several governments around the world openly admitting to the existence of Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs), the United States government has received a large push from its citizens to disclose the truth about their knowledge of this bizarre yet fascinating phenomenon.

As a result, in late 2014 Barack Obama’s right hand man, (Councillor) Jon Podesta, who was also the Chief of Staff under the Clinton administration, tweeted that one of his biggest regrets of 2014 was his inability to “secure the disclosure of UFO files” and that “the time to pull the curtain back on this subject is long overdue. We have statements from the most credible sources, those in a position to know – about a fascinating phenomenon, the nature of which is yet to be determined.” (You can read more about Podesta and UFOs here.)

Despite these recent public omissions, the White House still maintains that it does not have any such information. The thing is, it’s probably true, as the secrecy surrounding this subject most likely goes far beyond the government, extending into the world of private contractors and a tightly knit group of powerful international elites who control what Eisenhower called, “the military industrial complex.” He warned that this area carried the potential for a “misplaced power” to “exist and persist,” and that this was a “disaster.” (source)

https://www.collective-evolution.com/2015/07/21/u-s-government-releases-...

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 4:56pm
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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 7:28pm
ag1969
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Anti-vaccine witch hunt FAIL

Dr. Jack Wolfson cleared of all charges for exercising his free speech rights on the issue of vaccine risks and the stupidity of blind medical obedience

(NaturalNews) After Arizona cardiologist Dr. Jack Wolfson spoke out about the potential dangers of vaccines following the contrived Disneyland measles outbreak, he was aggressively attacked by the vaccine medical-industrial complex, which routinely accuses anyone who questions the party line on vaccines as being a danger to society.

Organized by vaccine industry trolls and paid negative PR operatives, a total of 38 complaints were filed against Dr. Jack Wolfson with the Arizona state medical board. This is all part of the effort of the vaccine industry to destroy the credibility of any person who exercises true scientific, rational thought on the issue of risks versus rewards for vaccine interventions in children and adults. The idea here is that if enough punishment and aggression is directed against some doctors who speak out on the issue of vaccine side effects, then all the other doctors who may be witnessing these damaging effects of vaccines will decide to stay silent.

Dr. Wolfson was smeared by the mainstream media while receiving death threats from vaccine trolls

Like many physicians who tell the truth about vaccine side effects and potential dangers, Dr. Wolfson received death threats and was threatened with violence. This is more common than you might suppose -- the very same industry that routinely commits medical violence against children in the form of toxic vaccine ingredients is also well-known for encouraging and even organizing online threats of violence against physicians who are attempting to help protect children.


Learn more: https://www.naturalnews.com/050473_Dr_Jack_Wolfson_medical_witch_hunt_vaccine_risks.html#ixzz3gZVDLYGP

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 7:41pm
Dyna mo hum
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I GOT YOUR COMMUNITY RIGHT HERE .... IMAGINE..

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 8:41pm
ag1969
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Ruffian

Here is a place that did kind of what you are thinking.

https://www.wellschool.org/

This guy sold a company and bought lots of land. He started the school and built little houses for the teachers. If my memory serves me, the houses even lacked electricity. The teachers and students and parents had a big organic farming operation on site and they ate the food in the school cafeteria. Lots of other good stuff.

Plus, as I have written before, the average person no longer even knows what freedom is. So some more schools might be good. The problem with slaves is they do not desire to be free, they desire to be masters. Someone needs to teach these kids!

Just be careful, if you keep telling everyone you are stupid, nobody will enroll in your school. 

The elites never send their kids to public school, so it is recession proof.

Throw it out there I always say...

Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 8:52pm (Reply to #5568)
Magpie
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Ruffian

I always wanted to build an "earthship".

https://earthship.com/

Even if your zoning laws allowed it, I can't imagine how much the tax assessment for that type of improvement would be... astronomical, I'm sure. 

ancaro imparo.
Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 9:40pm
ag1969
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FDA-Approved Drug Turns Ordinary People into Obedient Zombies

Editor’s Note: Did you know that scopolamine was extensively tested on Americans without their knowledge during the Cold War by the CIA via the MKUltra mind control project?

zombies

When I lived in Ecuador, I was warned about the pollen from the flower of a beautiful tree. The pollen is called “Devil’s Breath,” and when a tiny amount is blown into the face of an intended victim, it immediately saps that person’s free will, turning them into a compliance zombie who will do anything they’re commanded to do: Empty their bank account, engage in sexual acts or even donate a kidney.

This isn’t some urban legend, either. The Devil’s Breath pollen is rich in scopolamine, a potent drug that saps free will and turns people into zombies. Scopolamine can “can wipe the memory of its victims,” reports the Daily Mail:

Scopolamine can be blown in the face of a passer-by on the street, and within minutes, that person is under the drug’s effect – scopolamine is odourless and tasteless.

‘You can guide them wherever you want,’ he explained. ‘It’s like they’re a child.’

…The drug, he said, turns people into complete zombies and blocks memories from forming. So even after the drug wears off, victims have no recollection as to what happened. (Shhhhh! Please don’t tell Bill Cosby!)

FDA-approved drug that literally saps human will and turns people into obedient zombies

If all this sounds exactly like what we’re all witnessing in American society today, that’s because drug companies have turned scopolamine into an FDA-approved prescription drug.

Sold today as a transdermal patch, the scopolamine drug is offered under the name “Transderm Scop” and it’s designed to be placed right behind the ear, allowing the scopolamine drug to be absorbed into the bloodstream.

When the scopolamine chemical enters the bloodstream, it immediately affects the brain, turning a normal human being into an auto-suggestion hypnosis subject who believes and obeys anything they hear. If that person happens to be watching MSNBC while absorbing this drug, they might mindlessly come to believe that they’re supposed to vote for Hillary Clinton because she’s so smart, honest and awesome!

https://www.thedailysheeple.com/fda-approved-drug-turns-ordinary-people-...

World's Scariest Drug (Documentary Exclusive)
Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 10:47pm (Reply to #5570)
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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 10:51pm (Reply to #5572)
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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 11:01pm
Mr. Fix
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Back in a New York state of mind…

Ruffian,

It sounds like you're putting a lot of thought into this project, I think in principle, it sounds good. Magpie raises a valid point, the tax assessor would have a field day with it, followed by code enforcement, and just about every other agency if the authorities became aware of what you are up to. That being said, I wouldn't care either. For three years, I lived in a dirt field constructing Parade props, and restoring antique trucks, with a bunch of other guys. We all lived in trailers, or buses. None of it was legal, and yet the owner of the property had no problem waging war with the town. That's exactly what it takes. With everybody having a personal stake in the outcome, I think you'll have no problem attracting exactly the kind of people you're looking for.

As an idea, it's right up my alley.

Keep thinking out loud, I am enjoying watching your mind at work. yes

"When the student is ready, the teacher will appear."
Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 11:03pm (Reply to #5571)
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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 11:10pm (Reply to #5576)
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Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 11:19pm (Reply to #5578)
Mr. Fix
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How to evade the taxman and code enforcement…

At least where I live, anything on wheels is not considered a permanent structure, and is nontaxable.

This also takes care of the building code violations, because there aren't any.

Citizens owning their own homes is not a problem, because they can come with them, and they can leave with them.

I think this works out better than a whole bunch of little houses, for a whole bunch of reasons.

A Blue Bird Wander Lodge can provide luxury accommodations for a large family. wink

"When the student is ready, the teacher will appear."
Tue, Jul 21, 2015 - 11:38pm
Mr. Fix
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AG 1969, Here's an interesting question ...

What if ...

Scopolamine was dropped on a large population center, hypothetically, released from a plane.

You could literally make an entire urban area do whatever you want.

With all those videos over on Info Wars showing US troops practicing mowing down zombies, it really does start to make you wonder what they are up to.

Far more importantly, what's the antidote?

"When the student is ready, the teacher will appear."
Wed, Jul 22, 2015 - 12:48am (Reply to #5573)
Anonymous

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Wed, Jul 22, 2015 - 1:04am (Reply to #5579)
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randomness