Size Matters

Mon, Jul 28, 2014 - 11:49pm

Are you well endowed with a large stack?

As a young ignorant professor, I accepted a position at a college that offered me a job as an "endowed chair of mass communication." They made verbal promises that the endowment would be funded. Well you know what happened… they never endowed it. The “benefactor” had not made the large donation promised and the contract specified it would not be made until she passed away. I had lunch with her one day. She was not that old and in fine health. I should have called CALawyer for advice at that point.

But that small branch of a larger university really wanted to be noticed, so they set up the position anyway. I used to ask for money each year. I told my department chair, “I have this professorship, but I am not well-endowed. He chuckled and then said, “Yes, but in this case, size matters.”

Size also matters with getting ready for the future. This past weekend Gamble put the question to everyone, “How much physical is enough? I thought I was good until I saw a picture of someone's stack, I think there was over a hundred ounces!

First of all, it is never good to compare your metal endowment to pictures others. It can be depressing and guys shouldn’t do that. When I was in college my roommate was a body-builder and he would look at pictures of the muscle-bound hunks flexing their tanned oiled bodies, and it inspired him to work out more. Well in his case, that inspiration was effective because he had a body type that responded to weight-lifting. He was born with it! In my case, no matter how much I worked out (and I did lift with him every day after class), my biceps remained “unimpressive,” as the girls termed it. But I did get strong. Some guys just have a body that will bulk up, and some do not. As for stacking silver, no matter how much I gaze at piles of the shiny metals in my monthly subscription to Stacker magazine, I am unable to get more fiat into my budget to enable a trip down to the LCS without some work or a sensible business deal.

Fortunately, our metals endowments that we are building for ourselves and our families depend not on our body type or someone else’s gift, but on our own desire, needs, and ingenuity in earning the fiat to make the endowment grow.

But a couple of members provided some concrete answers for Gamble:

Erewenguy offered a formula for old guys: “Personally, I am about 65% paper, 25% pm, 10% cash, but then, I'm an "old" guy. At this point in my life living expenses are pretty modest and most new free cash goes into metals for savings rather than for insurance.” I’ll second that formula. My budget is about the same 55% in real estate, 40% in PMs and 5% cash & prep. If the cash grows, it will be allocated appropriately

Icarus also provided a sensible formula for anyone: “your stack times 5 (the estimated appreciation in purchasing power) should be enough to cover all your expenses with a 4% withdrawal rate, assuming that all your government pensions go away.” Simply figure in how many years you’ll need to be supported by that stack and work it in the formula.

Many of us are on a budget and building up a nice stack is not easy. At least it is cheaper these days. A few months after I began in late 2010 I was lamenting that I couldn’t get any silver for under per ounce, that I would have bought much more at if I had only known. When I go to the LCS, I want to be a big player, talk about silver prices and seem important to them. I want to feel the heft of the larger bars, or inspect the gold coins. But as soon as I drift to the cull box of old Morgans or look at the odd generic rounds, they turn remind me to hurry up and make my selection.

But is having the largest stack possible always the best? My wife is far less concerned with the size of my endowment than other factors. She wants to pay off the house and store away enough food and other necessary goods so that we do not struggle to survive. She would rather stock up on toilet paper, toothpaste, her special feminine cabinet in the bathroom, cleaning supplies, an extra broom, detergent, bleach and other such stuff. But my vain heart would much rather go to the coin or gun shop to get things I may need, rather than Wal-mart to get things I will need.

Dr Jerome: Hey honey, how about tonight we go out to dinner, a movie, and then, you know, the kids will be at their friend’s apartment, and we can, you know …

Mrs Jerome: Well, Romeo, we could do that if you hadn’t spent all our money on silver, cutting short our “personal pharmaceutical” budget, you know… with the next one, you get to nurse and change all the diapers.

So clearly we need to prepare in other ways to augment our stacks of metals. The prices of some goods will inflate as the dollar declines, but the prices of other goods may remain somewhat stable or even deflate. As a part time real estate investor, I am expecting the price of homes to continue to languish and perhaps even fall. I will be waiting with my modest stack when they hit bottom again. The family is growing. My son has a serious girlfriend. And while I may refuse to answer the door in our new economy when certain in-laws come knocking, I won’t turn away my kids and their new families. But more people under the roof will require more beds and at least a little more room. So I value diversity in investing—metals are good, but not neglecting everything else we need to feel civilized and care for those we love.

Even though I already said that size matters, it might be best to diversify rather than having the biggest stack possible, because size isn’t everything. Lately, I have had more time than fiat, so we are continuing to prepare our home, building a small storage area off the back porch, still working on my solar system. The materials can be found on Craigslist or at a used building supply near the home, making the projects very affordable. But If I drop my extra fiat for the month on metal, my tools sit idle and the home remains unfinished.

The problem of metal storage seems to be taken seriously here. In response to Gamble’s query, hindsight101 asked, “One issue for me is safe storage. Banks aren't safe. Is one's home safe? How well can it be hidden? How likely are you to reveal the hiding place with a gun to your head?

Those are good questions for all of us to think about. We have all heard the stories about home invasions. As I get older, I am not so sure I want to challenge a gang of thugs who kick down my door, even with a self-protective gear. I have been wondering if a “faux stack” (imported from China perhaps) in a poorly hidden safe would satisfy a burglar while my real stack is hidden elsewhere.

Silver stacks are heavy. Getting it off the bottom of my pond is a real chore, requiring me to dive down, feel around in the mud until I find it, come back up for another breath, go back down, tie on a rope, then get my son in a second boat to help me haul it up. The silver I hid up in the tree is easier to get down, but took me all day to get it up there. My next project is creating a watertight container that I can lower down into my septic tank. Maybe I should just install a “dummy” double switchbox labeled “security lights” by the back door and keep my gold coins in it.

My best protection is secrecy. I don’t want to call attention to my home or let anyone know I am storing anything of value in my pond, tree, or septic tank.

So we are trying to find that balance between accumulating sufficient metal of an unknown quantity that will ease our transition into the new economy. We had some wise advice posted in the thread the other night that I hope will be reiterated here. How much of stack you should have depends on several factors

  • Silver or gold? Silver has more upside potential. Gold is more stable.
  • How old are you?
  • How many people will be depending on you and how old are they?
  • Do you believe the collapse will be fast, total and disastrous? Or will it be slower, partial, and simply force us into a lower standard of living?
  • Will current debt be written off? Will you get off the hook for your mortgage, or will a bank come take your home after the new economy begins?
  • Will bankruptcy laws still apply? Better not count on it.
  • What do you want your standard of living to be?

Personally, I am working to settle my debts before a collapse. The last thing I want are banksters hounding me after a new economy begins—especially if they suspect I am holding out a stack somewhere based on my IP address and participation here. We have no guarantees that your bank loans will be forgiven or written down. If my mortgage company collapses, the note will be purchased nad the new holder will seek repayment—perhaps in revaluated currency. We should expect that the banks will survive and will still have government lapdogs to help them squeeze their debtors. And if you don’t like our government now, just wait until they improve it (for your own good) after the next collapse.

I am stacking and prepping in stages. We initially stacked with all we could (at high prices, I might add) and then started prepping. Later, after the price fell, we switched to stacking more. These days we are back to prepping for the lifestyle we want, with the perspective of our age and trajectory of our children’s lives.

As for metals trading, I have been trading JDST (short 3x ETF) and JNUG (long 3x ETF) with some success, taking profits when I call it right, holding on for the ride when I am wrong. So far so good. I just can’t seem to get trading out of my blood. It keeps me engaged in the site and the metals world more than just simply stacking. Besides, what else will I do with my employer IRA? BTATFH?* I suspect the fund will be MyRA’d* someday no matter what I do with it.

Well, I have asked more questions than I have answered here, but the answers are different for all of us.

As for stacking, yes, bigger is better. You will be thankful for every ounce you were able to add to your endowment. But do not neglect the toilet paper and a roof over your head.

Hey honey, about that date?

* Buy the all time f---ing high.

* the act of government herding of all IRAs into T-bills someday

About the Author


Spartacus Rex
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:02am

Sometimes Quality Trumps Quantity

1 Red Monster currently worth 63+ Green Monsters! How much space do you have?

Cheers, S. Rex

Jul 29, 2014 - 12:04am

First, and my stack is HONKIN big!

Too bad it was all lost in a tragic boating accident.

Hey, let me also say the 2nd best thing I did this year is get a dozen food storage buckets and gamma seal lids (google them) and fill them with non-perishables bought from Restaurant Depot. Not so much for the stacking, but when you buy in bulk you get a 75% discount off retail. Not only are you getting it cheap, you're killing inflation for the next year on those items.

Smartest thing was buying an old Chevy Metro. 52 miles per gallon, STOCK. Well, I did have to pay $750 for it and another $250 to fix it up. I only got $900 for my Crown Vic, so it actually cost me $100 to trade "up".

My wife agrees, every dollar you don't spend on this is a dollar available to spend on that.

Jul 29, 2014 - 12:06am

@Spartacus Rex

If you have a red monster, you are so my hero!

Spartacus Rex
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:14am

@ Inardozi - LOL

If you say so. LOL! I am the stupid type that obtains PMs the old fashioned way, w/ fiat NOT CC Debt. LOL

Cheers, S. Rex

Safety Dan
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:28am

Dr J, my wife says size

Dr J, my wife says size doesn't matter as much as the intent. I keep telling her I can make it bigger. Bigger is better, like any man knows. She tells me 'its ok', she gets this warm fuzzy feeling over the size of our stack.

I don't know what to believe. Maybe you can help?

Jul 29, 2014 - 12:39am

I'm not gonna compare stacks

I am not inclined to join other men in comparing the size of their stack.

It isn't the size of the stack but what you do with it.

But, then again, you have to have a stack in order to use it. If you have no stack, you might have to compete with those who do.

That would be an error for you not to have a stack.

But, then again, some people can act like they have stack when they really don't stack up at all.

I guess that's why we call it a FUBM because Blythe never had stack. She just had empty vault space and paper promises. Now, look... those talking bears had it right.

Strongsidejedi Safety Dan
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:44am

@safety dan

Sorry to the ladies in the audience, but I think that women in general (very much generalizing here) are not very good at interpreting or estimating distance and spatial measurements.

Some women may be just as happy with a short shiny stack versus a bigger shiny stack.

But, there are the girls who know the difference between a golden stack and a silver stack.

Some of the Indian and Chinese buyers of size appear to still gravitate to gold due to the differences culturally between middle class asian women who want more of a stack and the American and European women who believe that the gold standard does not exist.

Not saying anything else here, because I'm already probably too deep into this mixed metaphor.

Again, apologies to the women in the audience.

Fred Hayek
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:45am


Two women watch an expensive sports car roar up to the curb near them and a guy get out. One says to the other "Someone's trying to compensate for a short stack."

It's not how much you walk around with; it's how much you have when it comes time for the next generation.

Bongo Jim
Jul 29, 2014 - 12:47am
lnardozi Spartacus Rex
Jul 29, 2014 - 1:06am

@Spartacus Rex

For that matter, I got mine by converting my 401k. I have rental properties so I've never been in a position to hammer my credit. Still though, someone who really wanted to could get... hmm... I'd say better than 250k in metal that way with no risk of being made to answer for it. The law is the law, they use it to beat on us, I'd have no compunctions about using it to beat on them. To my mind, the only morality issues in play are when the contract is signed. Once signed, the terms are the terms, for fair or foul. Imagine if a million people did so - assuming a 50/50 distribution that'd be 100oz of gold and 6250oz of silver per person or 100,000,000 oz of gold and 6,250,000,000 oz of silver.

Think that might affect the market?

boomer sooner
Jul 29, 2014 - 1:41am

Stackin is a way of life.

Be it au, ag, pb, beans, paper or dirt, we accumulate over our lifetimes, just hoping to be able to give the next generation a step up. Too bad the policy makers don't agree.

The size of the stack does not matter, its the workin ass behind it! My stack may be little, but the 10-15 hour days sure help in the end.

My wife has no clue how big the stack is, the lights are off when the drawers are opened. Safer that way, otherwise I'd be in the doghouse.

Note, I almost blew a gasket last time at Sams, a package of Bounty paper towels was $24.99. Whats worse, when I came home that day, setting on the counter was that freakin package!

Thanks Dr J. Seems like you made it home safe and sound.

Note 2, During the day I listen to talk radio about half the time. I catch Dave Ramsey here and there. If we could get him to belIeve in PM's rather than than his mutual fund bs, millions of ounces would Disappear in a hurry. Between his radio show, books and Financial Peace workshops, wow. Might have to send him some of belangp's youtube vids.

Jul 29, 2014 - 3:25am

everyone wants to think

that theirs is big or at least big enough...hearing about others is one thing. seeing them, is another. it really makes me feel weird. such a personal thing. talking about it here is bad enough. but i'll do it anyway.

boomer i am with you, please let me be able to pass all this on down.

actually this kind of topic bums me out. and it is not because i have a small stack ;D thanks for bringing another great topic to the forefront dr. J. i missed the thread you are referring to, anyone care to post that link??

my basic philosophy on size is that i've done all i can and continue to, so if/when i need it it will have to be enough. it helps me sleep. but not tonight. my wife even asks me how big it is from time to time, honestly, i have an idea but at this point i don't even know. she does like round numbers but still thinks in paper $$. this is good for me. the last year hasn't changed is still only about 20 bucks/oz. i mean. wtf is that sheet?

i don't show mine to anyone either, not even my dad. take that back, my wife knows where most of it is...

i think it is also huMAN nature to always want a bigger one. you can always tell those that have really thought about it or those that are really proud of it. they love to tell you how and why they have the perfect stack. in an odd way i do admire that. but personally think of that famous quote in our history books from teddyR. replacing stack for stick in our case of course. reaching here...but it is late and I'm awake and this is how i think when i medicate. and when i get the LCS with paper in my pocket. i love to trade it. every time it is a rush. i love adding to it. i of course feel i am not buying enough but this stack has more to do with the future than anything else. how many maps now and where did i hide that last purchase...what was to bring my life simplicity has complicated things immensely.

i have a few other philosophies. one being don't put all your stack in one place. that would be my advice for anyone looking for some. now how to keep track of it all and what if i get eaten by a shark tomorrow are things i am looking for advice on still...

ahhh, the future is bright and i do like it when i get to sit down and really look at my stack. a lot of hard work. i am proud of that. i have to be because it is the only one i got. keeps me from getting out of my own head. it is my simple plan ahead for what i do not know. hopefully just a thanks you crazy old off to the ocean. that would be the best place for my stack. under the sea. if i just had a submarine...peace.b3

Spartacus Rex
Jul 29, 2014 - 3:56am
Jul 29, 2014 - 8:25am

early morning spin

The investigation isn't even completed and Germany, Inc. is saying "time is up?". Germany, Inc. who stands to lose the most?

Bloomberg followed up with this article:

This is starting to become evident, to me anyway, as a chance to dismantle the BRICS. With Russia being an important cog in the BRICS machine will all partners eventually stand with Russia economically? or is this the end?

The most important question I have is where does China really stand in this? I think China may be reaching that proverbial "fork in the road". If my memory serves me well didn't China announce in 2007 or 2008 that by 2015 they wanted the Renminbi to be convertible?

The kitchen is just starting to heat up, let's see who lines up with who. On one side we have gold and on the other we have the dollar. It's going to get hot soon enough.

Green Lantern
Jul 29, 2014 - 9:10am

Sorry to the ladies in the

Sorry to the ladies in the audience, but I think that women in general (very much generalizing here) are not very good at interpreting or estimating distance and spatial measurements.

Might not be a generalization. Although it may just sound like an outdated stereotype, there is actually scientific evidence to back up the claim that men are better navigators than women. It has been proven in many different studies that men have better spatial memory than women do.

That being said my wife has maintained good objectively in when best to buy at good price. The only problem she doesn't have a clue how to get to the LCS despite many trips.

Jul 29, 2014 - 9:21am


When I ponder formulas about how much PM one should own I run into the following possibilities. the worse the economy becomes, the more difficult it may be to get fair market value for your stack, but the more it will be worth. It may not be safe to go to a dealer and trade. People might follow you home, wondering if you have more. Maintaining a stack of food and other necessities (or living on food-producing land) may be more critical for survival than having PMs.

Dyna mo hum
Jul 29, 2014 - 9:23am

Dr J leave it to me...

Maria Muldaur - It Ain't the Meat, It's the Motion
Jul 29, 2014 - 9:24am

Variety is the spice of life...

...and everytime I add to my stack, it is different than the last. I have grown from a stacker into a coin collector. I have two different stacks in two completely different oceans. One is my spending when TSHTF stack, which includes junk silver, ASE's, Maples, generics and 5 and 10 oz bars. The other is my legacy stack which includes more numismatic stuff like the 2 oz. Gods of Olympus Zeus coin, perth mint, pandas, nicer condition Morgan and Peace, etc.

Don't get me wrong, I do not go out and buy numismatic stuff at huge premiums (usually), but I do by new stuff in the year of issue, while it is still only a couple bucks more than a generic, that I think will become numismatic because of either popularity, limited mintages, or both. I also got to a lot of flea markets and try to score some good deals on older stuff. Not too long ago I bought a Morgan at a flea market for $20 that is worth $250. I bought three WTC recovered eagles for $20 each that sell on ebay for $150 regularly. I bought a mint sealed 2004 Panda once for $27. And I have found that just about anything from the Perth Mint appreciated much more quickly than an ASE or a Maple.

I think RCM comes out with a lot of really nice coins, but they are way too expensive even at first issue. Although the Canadian Wildlife series was reasonably priced over spot when those coins were released.

A small example would be that I would rather pay $22.98 for Perth Saltwater Crocodile than $24.50 for an ASE. I would be willing to bet that within 2 years, the salt water crocodile will be selling for far more than the 2014 ASE.

Just my two cents.

As far as my wife is concerned, she is very happy we have a stack and has rarely given me shit for adding to the stack. What we buy though is up to me. My wife doesn't know the difference between a Morgan and a Turd Round. To her, it is all silver.

Because of this, I value the stack much higher than my wife does. I know my 2004 Panda is worth over $100, to her it is just another ounce at spot price.

Colonel Angus
Jul 29, 2014 - 9:42am

More diversity

My wife often wants to invest in other areas, as she hasn't gone as far off the deep end as I have...well, yet. She is getting there.

So when I've wanted to add to my stack of gold, I've gone to auctions and bought her jewelry below spot price. For instance I bought her a three diamond necklace for the spot cost of the 18k gold in it. The three diamonds were more or less free with the purchase. Nobody else saw it for what it was worth, and I know a thing or two about familial goodwill.

She got really upset one time when I spend several thousands in fiat on silver with it down at $18 or so. So I traded some of the coins for a really large sterling silverware set. She knows the antibacterial properties of silver and got a set that had familial meaning to her. So we win. I have silver that gets used everyday. And none of the thugs would ever think to look in the silverware drawer for value. It's the same old stainless to them...and hidden right out in the open.

A suggestion: I have all these cheap fire safes you can get at Wal-Mart for $40 apiece. They are file boxes but they give you the ability to withstand heat up to some insane temperature for 30 minutes or something. I have them sitting in our office, in our homeschool room, down in the basement. They have tags on them that say, "family photos," "business records," "Mom's life insurance and docs," etc. None of those things are actually in these cheap safes. I'll let you guess what is.

Also you can hide stuff among other foodstuffs. You can have a dummy box of cereal at the back of the pantry that has a couple of rolls of coins in it. You can have a cellar like we do with a dummy can of green beans that has coins in it. Or if your stack is bigger, you might use another five gallon bucket with an identical gamma seal lid on it. It just might not contain wheat. The best place to hide something is right out in the open so that it looks like everything else. DO NOT hide anything in your master bedroom unless it is a small stack or a dummy stack. Our house looks like we might not have much, so they find the small stack, the HiPoint 9mm with a box and a half of shells, and they think they have everything...just the way we want it.

Jul 29, 2014 - 9:53am

Two helpful tips for stacking

1. When contemplating how much is enough, please don't forget that you may have responsibilities beyond just your immediate family. Your stack post-TEOTGKE also needs to be enough to pay your minions, informants and assorted street muscle, provide sound money to keep the black market humming along for a strong local economy, AND have enough left over to purchase military-grade weapons systems from corrupt government officials (as if there is any other kind). Those tanks and APC's aren't going to pay for themselves, you know.

2. 1000 oz bars become dangerously unstable when you stack them higher than three feet. To prevent injury, use a storage warehouse, a forklift, and this helpful pallet system from IKEA.

Stack on, troops!

Jul 29, 2014 - 9:55am

Stacking and Prepping

is a way of life with me right now and my size doesn't matter as I'm not using it right now anyway. The only time that I see it is when I handle it and add to it. LMAO I'm in a race to be prepared so the more I Stack or Prep is going to be beneficial for me and my family WTSHTF. Keep Stacking

By the way, something strange going on with the Turk.

Video unavailable
Jul 29, 2014 - 10:18am

Wondering is enough enough?

With silver, all you need know, it's the peoples money and exchangeable for goods and services time tested for millennium. Ounces in silver eagles may be divided into pieces of eight if we revert back to really adverse times. Plus you have copper or pence as it was called in early history of America. Find and garner out all real copper pence pennies from 1982 on back for smaller transactions. I've garnered out a good stack of copper over the last 6 years from just checking change. Nickels are also good to hold out as the beasts war machine always needs nickel for steel. Silver keeps you in business with everyday transactions under tough economic times.

Gold is your wealth long term preservation, especially if you need pick up and relocate to begin a new. Gold to silver ratios would revert to mean of long term average of around 15 to 1 under normal circumstances. It has not been normal since the dead head fed began it's distortion of assets from 1913 in the US. Average home prices before the dead head fed would put on average a median priced abode at 400 ounces of silver compared to 40 ounces of gold or 10 to 1 ratio was likely more the mean normally. With the distortion of sound money, stuff of substance today, and all things as they are outrageously bubble scrumptious to the max today, an over run in sound money mania will occur as in passed paper ponzi fiat panics. The paper money valuation to sound money, when in depression era times of stuff you don't need all coming to market at once in over supply, to hyperinflationary stuff you do need to survive becoming scarce reaching a mean, safe time for sound paper currency to emerge is an ounce of gold buys 1 Dow share. We can take our former great depression stats for good measure. Of course under extremes the price of the Dow may not be available, all sound money subject to current economic exchange with the community.

One silver dollar of around .77 silver would be an average good days wage for real money normal times. 10 dollars and found or room and board for a month was a good living back in pioneer times. When dead head fed black magic illusionist had no control of currency your sound money of copper, nickel, and silver went a long way so you won't need much silver for subsistence and everyday living.

You don't need to wait to exchange paper fiat for food, guns and ammo, which are big winners in economic blithe. There's plenty of options for food to store 2 years worth and longer if you like for relatively taking up little space with freeze dried and other options. Water is always a bulk storage concern but some is warranted with filters and purifiers for tough times.

Lots to consider in getting by when things go bad. You can be certain from here on out the world is not going to break out in peace and the banksters will not rob you of everything you haven't nailed down to keep physically in your possession.

The bottom line is if you're a debt slave and have debt which cannot be settled outright now, then forget about all the above, as you'll be hounded, hunted, and tossed to and fro by the criminals, until you're bled dry to pay the debt. SQUEEZED FOR EVERY LAST FARTHING WITH NO MERCY! Debt, money, and human nature remain the same. Count on it, as certain as debtors prison, in all it forms is as normal as the grass is green.

Nick Elway
Jul 29, 2014 - 10:43am

Nickels! Careful with the


Careful with the weight, each $100 face is 10 kg Base Metal Coin Melt Value Calculation
Generated on July 29, 2014.

Total Face Value:$100 Coin

Type:1946-2014 Jefferson Nickel

Copper Price: $3.2441 / pound
Nickel Price: $8.5153 / pound

Total melt value is $100.57.

The perfect inflation AND deflation hedge, a bit awkward in quantity.

The Nick Elway!

Jul 29, 2014 - 10:56am

Size does matter

Just look at the fiat fines issued against the banks of the libor scandal compared to the Yukos fines. Sure no problem here, move along. Thanks Dr. J for the post

Jul 29, 2014 - 11:11am


cracks me up....when folks make forecasts for lower PM prices and suggest that they are somehow unique....when in reality, they are just dense, portable, no-counter-party risk instruments reflecting real -OBVIOUS- inflation...

copper, nickel, uranium, beef, corn, is all up a lot since the 90's...."cheap oil forever" was the Economists prediction in 99....

is there a cpi bug? beef bug? nickel bug?

It is monetary inflation brainiac. It has nothing to do with anything other than central bankers giving there member banks free money. Debasing currency....Period. It is no wonder that the hottest real estate markets are DC and Manhattan.....they reside next to the pigtrough.

Jul 29, 2014 - 11:19am

Easy availability of fake bars from China

I was surprised that I didn't read any concern about the easy availability of these Chinese plated bars. I'm not so sure that I could spot a fake. Sometimes I do my stacking "shopping" at coin shows. I like the convenience of the 10 oz bars, but this posting convinced me to stay with 90% junk silver. And if these Chinese vendors can copy these bars, what other bullion products are they copying?

Jul 29, 2014 - 12:15pm

All things remain SOP during f*mc week

as nothin but blue skies for the USDinker dollar POS and real money stopped in it's tracks to down. There's paper chasing profit yet to be made like none other predictability during dead head fed fed goon speak f*mc week. If you've been milking it the last 3 years you're a stellar player if you've put it off as this time it will be different then odds are stacking forever against you next f*mc week yellen speak will be different. Always goes to the old adage scared money doesn't make money. Too me the frns traded in for food, guns & ammo, and sound money physical gold and silver have never left me with a sleepless night. If if I die, I hand off sound money to family and posterity to do as these desire. If I don't die and live another 2 decades which is likely at 62. I get to live the frugality and wisdom of not throwing in with paper ponzi fraud gone wild. EPIC CONSEQUENCES TO BE EXACTED NATURALLY FROM MORTGAGING EVERY FUTURE REALITY OF PROSPERITY THROUGH MORAL PROVEN FIDELITIES TO IT ALL BEING SUCKED UP INTO A UNIVERSAL BLACK HOLE VACUUM OF DEBT, MANY GENERATION WILL DIG OUT FROM BEING BURIED UNDER. Hey! No condemnation from me into buying into the debt is wealth lie; we can spend our way to prosperity through printing money, is of no consequence. We've all fallen into it and returning to moral financial frugal living within our means, is merely a beginning for some of us here but will be the only way out for all others, as there will be no credit exteneded for who knows how long after this fraudster criminal bankstering vaporization. Always have said no one will trust paper currency or paper bond contracts for 1000 years after this epic glo0bal collapse; PANIC!

Jul 29, 2014 - 1:08pm

Fake bars


The website also showed fake APMEX bars for sale. I am not sure I could tell one either. And with silver, they have the option of using a heavier alloys to get size-weight ratio just right. This is making 90% worn coins look a lot better.

And frankly, I have no qualms about purchasing fake bars, loading a safe that thieves might find if we had a break in, and then alerting the local LCS to beware if I had a theft. But what guarantee do you have that they will catch it, if the specific gravity is correct. they could unknowingly sell at 10oz bar to even a knowledgeable customer.

Can I even trust APMEX anymore with these bars floating around (pictured below). The trustworthiness of American corporations is called to question across the board now. What would keep a legit dealer from sneaking fake bars into a large order? If they get caught, they can apologize profusely and make it good, blaming those clever counterfiaters* out there.

Those Franklins, Walkers, Mercs, Morgans and Peace dollars are beginning to shine a bit more in my view. And I won't even go into the metaphor of increasing your stack with something fake.

Best movie scene of all time! From Spinal Tap

1 oz APMEX replica .999+ fine silver plated bullion bars

FOB Price:US .50 - 2.00 / Piece Get Latest PriceMin.Order Quantity:50 Piece/PiecesSupply Ability:5000 Piece/Pieces per MonthPort:gzPayment Terms:L/C,T/T,Western Union,MoneyGram,paypal

Contact Supplier

* misspelling was intentional!

Jul 29, 2014 - 1:21pm

Stack size . . .

Hoooo, boy. Where to begin?

I have had a mistrust of government for a long time. So, I started stacking Au over 16 years ago. It was around $300/oz. then.

My wife and I bought 40 acres around that time, and built a home on it, and grow a lot of stuff. The rest we rent to a local produce farmer. Of course, we have a well, and some solar power, but still on the grid.

Then, I started reading Ted Butler's stuff in about 2002-2003, and he got me kooked on Ag. It was around $5/oz when I quit my job, took some of my 401-k money, paid the taxes, and bought 10 1000 oz bars with part of it, and transferred the rest to a IRA and bought silver stocks.

After a nice rise in the stocks, I cashed some more out, paid the taxes, and bought more phyzz.

Around 2006-2007 I realized that 9-11 was an inside job, and also I began to realize that there could be a nasty disaster being prepared for all of us, when the system breaks down. The bankers and their henchmen won't go down without a fight. And, even if they don't approach me, the have-nots are likely to steal whatever and wherever they can. The nearest small city is 30 miles away and the nearest large city is 60 miles away.

So, I started prepping in other ways, to include food storage and upgrading my gun collection to include a .357 mag revolver, an .45 ACP automatic and a AR-15. I also stocked in a lot of ammo for them and my .30-.06's and .22s and 12 ga. auto shotgun.

The food storage issue is thorny; I have 4 kids, three married. Two grandkids with another on the way. It takes a lot of food to feed that many people for even 3 months. I'm working on it, but it's not cheap or easy.

I spread the PMs around by gifting to my kids. They can do what they want with it, though so far they have all kept what I gave them. I continue to buy more when I find good deals, with excess fiat after bills are paid. My net worth is about 75% PMs (phyzz), 5% paper PMs, 2% cash, 18% RE.

While the last three years has seen the bankers and pols recreate their fiat dreamworld somewhat, it cannot last. So, I continue to prep and stack, prep and stack. And, have as much fun along the way as we can. What else can be done when you have such a mindset?

Jul 29, 2014 - 1:23pm

My Fishing Boat

My fishing boat was a beauty. She was 24’ of sleek turquoise fiberglass. My wife named her the “Titanic”. I still remember that fateful night as clearly as if it happened yesterday.

We were taking our stash out on a large river with plans to bury it it in a safe place we had picked out. That’s when disaster struck. We hit a huge Yeti cooler that was full of ice. Someone had left it on a partially submerged cypress stump. We must have been doing 35 or 40 and when we hit the damn thing. It tore the inboard/outboard drive and the back of the boat off. We were both thrown out and had to swim about 100 yards to the shore.

Our boat sunk and so did our stash. So did the Yeti cooler. Needless to say, we were unable to find it (our stash) even though we searched for days.

Subscribe or login to read all comments.


Donate Shop

Get Your Subscriber Benefits

Exclusive discount for silver purchases, and a private iTunes feed for TF Metals Report podcasts!

Key Economic Events Week of 6/24

6/25 10:00 ET New Home Sales
6/25 1:00 pm ET Chief Goon Powell
6/25 5:30 pm ET Goon Bullard
6/26 8:30 ET Durable Goods
6/27 8:30 ET Q1 GDP final guess
6/28 8:30 ET Personal Income and Consumer Spending
6/28 8:30 ET Core Inflation
6/28 9:45 ET Chicago PMI

Key Economic Events Week of 6/17

6/18 8:30 ET Housing Starts and Building Permits
6/19 2:00 ET FOMC Fedlines
6/19 2:30 ET CGP presser
6/20 8:30 ET Philly Fed
6/21 9:45 ET Markit flash June PMIs

Key Economic Events Week of 6/10

6/11 8:30 ET Producer Price Index
6/12 8:30 ET Consumer Price Index
6/13 8:30 ET Import Price Index
6/14 8:30 ET Retail Sales
6/14 9:15 ET Cap Ute and Ind Prod
6/14 10:00 ET Business Inventories

Key Economic Events Week of 6/3

6/4 All day Fed conference in Chicago
6/4 10:00 ET Factory Order
6/5 9:45 ET Markit Services PMI
6/5 10:00 ET ISM Services PMI
6/6 8:30 ET US Trace Deficit
6/7 8:30 ET BLSBS
6/7 10:00 ET Wholesale Inventories

Key Economic Events Week of 5/28

5/28 10:00 ET Consumer Confidence
5/30 8:30 ET Q1 GDP 2nd guess
5/31 8:30 ET Personal Income and Consumer Spending
5/31 8:30 ET Core Inflation
5/31 9:45 ET Chicago PMI

Key Economic Events Week of 5/20

5/20 7:00 pm ET CGP speech
5/21 10:00 ET Existing Home Sales
5/22 2:00 ET FOMC minutes
5/23 9:45 ET Markit PMIs
5/24 8:30 ET Durable Goods

Key Economic Events Week of 5/13

TWELVE Goon speeches through the week
5/14 8:30 ET Import Price Index
5/15 8:30 ET Retail Sales and Empire State Manu. Idx.
5/15 9:15 ET Cap. Ute. and Ind. Prod.
5/15 10:00 ET Business Inventories
5/16 10:00 ET Housing Starts and Philly Fed
5/17 10:00 ET Consumer Sentiment

Key Economic Events Week of 5/6

5/9 8:30 ET US Trade Deficit
5/9 8:30 ET Producer Price Index (PPI)
5/9 10:00 ET Wholesale Inventories
5/10 8:30 ET Consumer Price Index (CPI)

Key Economic Events Week of 4/29

4/29 8:30 ET Pers Inc, Cons Spend, Core Infl
4/30 8:30 ET Employment Costs
4/30 9:45 ET Chicago PMI
5/1 8:15 ET ADP jobs report
5/1 9:45 & 10:00 ET Markit and ISM Manu PMIs
5/1 10:00 ET Construction Spending
5/1 2:00 ET FOMC Fedlines
5/1 2:30 ET CGP presser
5/2 8:30 ET Productivity and Unit Labor Costs
5/2 10:00 ET Factory Orders
5/3 8:30 ET BLSBS
5/3 9:45 & 10:00 ET Markit and ISMServices PMIs

Key Economic Events Week of 4/22

4/22 10:00 ET Existing Home Sales
4/23 10:00 ET New Home Sales
4/25 8:30 ET Durable Goods
4/26 8:30 ET Q1 GDP first guess