Finding Common Ground

Mon, Dec 5, 2011 - 10:56pm

I set out tonight to write another in the long line of posts regarding the Fed, The EE, S&P, WOPR and MFing Global. I got about 15 minutes into it and I erased the whole, frickin thing.

Tonight, I'm just not in the mood. Yes, it's all bullshit. S&P mentions that they are ready to downgrade virtually every credit on The Continent and the PMs tank. This is, of course, just another bullish development for the PMs but that doesn't matter. What matters is that the euro declined, so the dollar rallied and WOPR sold the PMs. Whatever. BTFD.

There, that was easy. Instead of wasting your time with a lengthy essay full of charts, I was able to spell it all out in just 55 words. Now we can move on.

A few weeks ago, I found a new blog via the "blog roll" on the left-hand side of the ZH homepage. It's written by a guy by the name of Jim Quinn. I have no idea who he is or whether we have anything in common. I do know, however, that I like his site. Visiting there this evening, I read his latest post. It's linked below.

As you know, I've not been an active supporter of the #occupiers. Frankly, I don't trust them. At this time, I'm not sure I can trust their intentions or their leaders. However, it is quite clear that this first wave of protesters do make some legitimate points and Mr. Quinn has summarized them well. Not knowing Mr. Quinn, it's certainly possible that we have very little in common "politically" but we do agree on one very important point. Namely, that the destruction of the wealth and the freedom of middle-income citizens worldwide is almost complete and, at the end, the world will either turn toward freedom and the rule of law or it will regress deeper into fascism and tyranny.

You've likely noticed that I'm an ardent believer in finding common ground. If we are to emerge from the darkness with freedoms intact, it will only be through cooperation and understanding. Polarity and vilification are the tools of tyrants. We must work together if we are to recover liberty. A good starting point would be a positive and constructive thread of comments to this post. TF

About the Author

turd [at] tfmetalsreport [dot] com ()


Dec 5, 2011 - 10:59pm



Woo Hoooooo

Colonel Angus
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:06pm

Maybe the common ground is...

...standing against bullshit, in whatever form we find it.

There, I can agree with that.

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:11pm

Swiss Am

Not sure if anyone has seen the adverts by Swiss America that were refused by the networks, I just found the link via GATA. If anything TF, they will cheer you up and I'm not sure that SA doesn't want them to get out since they posted them. All the best :D 

"The Wizards of Oz" - Obama and Bernanke Commercial: Part 2 (by Swiss America)
Edward G
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:12pm

Positive thread

 Well said Turd.....we can all humbly maturely and respectfully learn together here, and be proud of that..... if anyone gets a buzz out of bickering online there are plenty of other venues available. A closed mind or heart is not going to learn anything new. peace x

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:12pm

Common Ground - It's all about Liberty.

Agree Turd - Common ground is a good place to start. 

Liberty is the position where everything of value starts. Without liberty we don't have trust, we don't have development, we don't have sound money, we don't have faith in our fellow citizens, we don't have community, we don't have safety, we don't have "rule of law", we don't have a future.

Without Liberty we have tyranny - it really is that simple.

Buckets o Plenty
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:19pm


Not ad for my first post. This is a great site and community! Thanks Turd Jim Edit- More like 5th due to a Monday Night Football distraction

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:21pm

Takes two...

Finding common ground is the way we were taught to solve problems, and is how normal people "swing the deal". The issue is not, I think, with the common man, dare I say the 99%, being willing to dialogue and work to a solution. The issue is that there is no other with whom to dialogue. In fact, I am unsure of with whom, now, the common man has the opportunity to dialogue. The system as it stands, is divided into so many facets of human nature, heritage, and agenda as to defy the advent of meaningful and effective conversation. I fear the center cannot hold. In systems theory, closed energy consuming systems strive for homeostasis, balance of a (or any) sort; a multitude of contortions are possible in maintenance of the system. When that balance finally is impossible, when there are no more moves to be made they spontaneously and cataclysmically reorganize. I think we may be at that point, whether we like it or not. Given the present "powers that be" we may be past the point of re-establishing a working balance. I see no evidence yet of anything that would lead me to not believe that a cataclysmic re-organization is inevitable and most likely imminent. Like our mentor, the Turd, I advocate PREPPING!

Be Prepared
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:23pm

Comfortably Numb

When I was a child
I caught a fleeting glimpse
Out of the corner of my eye
I turned to look but it was gone
I cannot put my finger on it now
The child is grown,
The dream is gone.
I have become comfortably numb.

Pink Floyd – Comfortably Numb

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:30pm

Thanks big, yellow-hatted dude /Virtual memory heaven

Received my hat today, so thanks!

I hear you on the exhaustion part of this. I follow the markets a bit differently also lately. Not immersed in them but just aware they aren't doing much, like stuck in a groove for now waiting on the next big news item. It's like we don't even have real markets anymore that are tradeable and based on anything real or consistent enough to pattern off of. Not all the time, but sometimes.

Like now.

And as far as deleting stuff and "why bother?" I hear you there also.

 I've stepped away from the computer and hit refresh many times and left some strong thoughts/feelings in virtual memory heaven. I don't think I've regretted ever doing so and wishing I had the post back because the best part of it was typing it out an thinking it and then letting it go and the thought/concern that went with it.

Tomorrows another day! Goodnite all.

Be Prepared
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:31pm

The Business of Government is Good

Well, its not really's just that Government is really Good at making more of itself to our detriment.


Economical Disaster
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:34pm

Commies AND NAZIS...

They both take care of I say... whats the difference?

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:36pm

Please learn the difference between commies & Nazis.

Turd wrote : "....the world will either turn toward freedom and the rule of law or it will regress deeper into fascism and tyranny."

With all due respect.....

It is socialism, not national socialism that we face.

It is Marxist communism, not fascism that we are on the verge of.

"Share the wealth" and "a redistribution of the wealth" are both Marxist dogma.

If we lose sight of what threatens us, then all is surely lost.

Marxist would like nothing better than for their next victims to lose sight of what threatens them.
AlienEyes Economical Disaster
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:42pm

@ Economical Disaster

They killed each other over the "difference."

Then there are those that insist that "ignorance is bliss".

I am not one of those.

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:43pm

Listen to what the man says...

Just "Listen to What the Man says".......

"A good starting point would be a positive and constructive thread of comments to this post. TF"

(Not being bossy, it just fit wink)

Dr Durden
Dec 5, 2011 - 11:49pm

Good for you Turd

It's a total waste of time to follow the criminals around and try to catch them before they pull their next trick. Look at your charts. Go ahead, take the daily or weekly for the USD, gold, silver and just extend the lines out 5 - 10 years. Take a month off. Come back and look at how far from the trendline (the long term one!) they've gotten.

They want you to think it's a game, but it's not. Many have fallen exhausted and pennyless because they burnt out thinking they could win. It's half endurance, half speed. Like Michael Ruppert says (but obviously doesn't follow his own advice cause he's often wrong): if there's a bear in your camp site, you don't have to be faster than the bear, you just have to be faster than the slowest camper. (roughly paraphrased).

Stack on. The properties of your stash will remain long after your time is up.

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:51pm

Au Ag - Frustrating

Even more drops in Asia trading. What in the world is going on to make people want to sell PMs in the face of what is going on. It's all BS. If anyone has a good idea BESIDES manipulation, I'd like to hear it. Is everyone liquidating Au just to get their hands on paper dollars???? The while world is crazy.

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:52pm


The concept of a common ground is only for the rest of us. Greed had no common ground with loving thy neighbor. I have three concepts that work for everyone. (1). Whatever is first in ones life they will NEVER get enough of. (2). Everyone has the money to buy whatever they really want but not only what they really need. (3). We always have time for what is truly first in our lives.

The only way that things will ever be common to all is when a greater force than the evil is overpowered and becomes subject to it's rule. Until then, nothing will change by governments or laws.

Finally, Demonax said long ago, "He lamented the unprofitableness of good laws, by being in bad men's hands". 

Dec 5, 2011 - 11:52pm

@ DrkPurpleHaze

You are aware that Sir Paul holds the dubious distinction of being the only man in history to get his arse kicked by a one legged woman, right?


Dec 5, 2011 - 11:53pm

Socialism, Fascism and all that crap...

Might want to try opening those alien eyes of yours. Try this...

1. Draw a line from left to right

2. Label Fascism, Communism, Fabian Socialism, State / National Socialism, Democratic Socialism (Social Democracy for the dim-witted), Corporate Cronyism, Syndicalism, etc. wherever you think they ought to be on that line. 

3. Draw a single point far, far away well below the line above.

4. Label the point Individualism and Rule of Law.

5. Now draw vectors from the point to each of the -isms on your line.

As each election cycle waivers back and forth along that line, decade by decade you drift further away from the point along those vectors until a century has passed and you find out you are a serf.


Dec 6, 2011 - 12:01am

@ UncleFester

You might want to take a history course and finish it with a passing grade.

As for your inane drafting exercise, I already understand it so your effort to explain what you don't understand via geometry is sadly, wasted.

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:03am

Alien Eyes

Instead of a line, draw an oval...rotating vector bitches.

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:03am

I agree and not getting into pissing contests.

Perhaps it's an Idaho thing but I take info from everywhere. I'm a conservative/constitutionalists in my politics. But I'll embrace any tree hugger on solar energy or growing food or whatever. I'm incredibly small scale and by no means a mover or a shaker in the markets. I buy 5-10 oz. a month at best, got a years worth of meat in the freezer and a years worth of food. I do my best and let the devil take the hind most. I'm small scale in everything but it's what I can do being disabled. Don't worry Turd we all know you and pay no attention to the guttersnipes and fools. We value what you are doing!

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:08am

 Euro Crisis Destabilizing

Euro Crisis Destabilizing the Dollar
By: Dr. Ron Paul, U.S. Congressman

-- Posted Monday, 5 December 2011 | Share this article | Source: 

In response to pressure from Wall Street, the White House and central banks in Europe, the Federal Reserve last week drastically cut interest rates for currency swaps to benefit troubled European banks. This will flood world markets with more dollars and will soon mean rising prices for every American at the grocery store. This extra liquidity will temporarily ease the cash crunch for irresponsible bankers, but in the long run it will make the situation much worse for consumers all over the world. Equities markets registered big gains at the news, but only for a day. Make no mistake - this is not capitalism, and this is not how a free market operates. In a free market, bankruptcies happen, even to large banks. We must remember, free markets are the true and best regulators of financial mismanagement.

By contrast, under our current form of special interest corporatism certain businesses are granted too-big-to-fail status and are never allowed to go bankrupt. They keep profits generated during the good times generated by the Fed's monetary inflation, yet their losses are socialized through inflationary bailouts. This means you and your family eventually pay for the Fed's decisions because every dollar you earn is worth less. 

​Read full article at

[Mod. note: please remember NOT to paste full articles]

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:08am

Provide your own metaphor, as

Provide your own metaphor, as you please.....

Video unavailable
Dec 6, 2011 - 12:11am

Great post Turd, thanks and

great link. Powerhouse article! Really appreciated it and all you do.

Merry Christmas Turd

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:15am

Tea Party or OWS?

I agree with most of what the author says but I think OWS is a chimera and likely being directed by the usual suspects who answer to Obongo, Soros, etc.

The Tea Party has been saying the same stuff for a couple of years and has elected dozens of people to office to try to do something. I'm guessing most of the OWS would vote for another dose of Obongo and never set foot in a Tea Party event.

Has any figure emerged from this OWS to challenge the establishment? No. Because they are the dupes of that establishment. We should be trying to attract any like minded people from OWS into the Tea Party movement which actually is doing something about this national crisis of confidence and leadership.

We should repeal the 16th and 17th amendments and RADICALLY enforce the provisions of the 10th amendment. Get politically active and support and WORK for candidates pledged to do it.

Juan Moment
Dec 6, 2011 - 12:17am

Gold to revisit $1500?

Turd, kudos for linking to a site written by someone you politically don't really agree with. You strength of character is one of the aspects that keep me reading here. I personally have been checking in on the Burning Platform since March or so when I first came across Jim's site and would rate it as one of my top 10 economy blogs.

With regards to the question raised in the previous thread whether Gold could drop back to the $1500 mark, below are the Gold charts for 2011 and 2008. Guess which one is which?

The 2008 gold price dropped after the above chart's cut off point another 22%, from $900 to $700. So in answer to the question could gold this time round head south from $1700 to $1500, another 12% drop, I'd say sure, why not?

With most financial analysts predicting that compared to the picnic of 2008 the upcoming crash will be a disco on crack, I don't see why gold could not go down, at least initially. Not as drastic as silver, but down nevertheless.

Remember folks, we are talking paper price, Comex figures. And when stock markets crash and everybody is scrambling for liquidity, gold futures will be sold to cover margin calls in other investments.

What also should be kept in mind, by gold falling to the $1500 levels, it would merely get back to its upper long term trend line, leaving the secular bull market intact.

Even though it gets knocked around from time to time, like a true champion Gold always gets back up and wins the next round. And its not that I don't agree with those of you who believe that the fundamentals of Gold today are simply too strong for it to revisit those $1500 lows.

  • In contrast to 2008 we had since QE1 & 2 and therefore the cash out there chasing metals has multiplied,
  • the Chinese are now allowed to buy retail and do so hand over fist,
  • Central Banks all over the world are loading up on solid money, and
  • the recent bullish looking CoT's

Those arguments all hold water, and for all I know in the long run Gold will fetch 5 digits.

However, from my observations, despite its underlying strength, the cascading waterfall effect caused by paper gold holders having to cash out to come up with the funds needed to repair the damage in their other portfolios, coupled with a strategically placed CME margin hike "to reduce volatility" in the choppy markets following say a major bank collapse or a sovereign default, and et voila, there is your $1500. 

Within a 5 day period, in May this year Gold fell by 5%, in July by 6%, in August by 9% and most recently in September from $1800 to $1590, a whopping 11% in a week. So would a another 12% drop from here to $1500 be possible in the next 12 months? Chances aren't that bad, especially since we haven't seen the big momma yet, the day the the tape painters will run out of red ink and the fat lady finally performs her song,

And to make this speculative guess of mine more interesting, giving me something to look forward to should the gold ounces in my safe go down in paper $ value, I am prepared to offer the wager some other posters have been proposing.

Deal: Should Gold within the next 12 months hit an intraday low of at least US$1500, who ever accepts the bet owes me 1 oz fine silver coin, mail cost inclusive. On the flip side, should Gold make it through the next 365 days without touching or going below $1500, I will mail the other party 1 oz fine silver coin.

There is only one bet, so first one to accept it is in.

Now, I am not making this bet because some wave theory or other predictive model has convinced me that the 1500 mark is guaranteed, far from it, I wouldn't be at all surprised if for some reason Gold takes off like a rocket into the $2000's and never looks back, but to add some spice to the game and have a little gamble. Lives too short to play it save every day and I reckon I am in with a 51% chance.

Dec 6, 2011 - 12:19am


Am I right in my understanding that the FED has until the 21st Dec 2012 to rbe enewed by CONgress it's right to continue plundering and stealing from the USSA and the World? Or is it 2013? If it is 2012, then how does CONgress vote on it right in the middle of the elections and just prior to Christmas Eve? Seems it may sneak through for another 100 years with this timing! Seems the OWS should focus on END the FED! This is at the root of all evil, I believe. A dishonest money system in private hands. Fix this and return to the Constitution's tenets. A very simple message that could grow the movement to the point that polititians may heed. Whatever happened to all the Audit the Fed bills? Wasn't there a new Senate bill championed by Ron Paul's son? Seems the USSA citizen is on a hiding to nothing!

Georgie Georgie
Dec 6, 2011 - 12:23am
Dec 6, 2011 - 12:24am


GOOD POST. best i can say right now. I listen, because, I belive in what I am listening to


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