There He Goes Again

Mon, Oct 24, 2011 - 7:55pm

At some point, I guess I've got to stop and decide whether or not it's just wishful thinking.

About two weeks ago, I gave you this:

I'd been itching for a gold rally but, until now, it hasn't developed. In the post above, I called for a rally in the HUI to 560-580 and it made it to 560 before falling back to 500 last week. A sharp rally has it back to 538 tonight and it still looks like 580-600 is in the cards. That would be about a 10% rally from here.

But what's got me really worked up is the latest CoT survey. Remember how I always say that the only consistent way to make money trading the metals is to sell when all looks rosy and buy when all looks dreary? The tough part is to get yourself to actually follow that discipline as it goes against basic human nature. Put a different way, history has shown that you want to buy with the banks when the specs are selling. Additionally, you should sell when the specs are strongly buying. Now, back to that CoT survey. Note these week-over-week changes:

Large Specs long: -3901 contracts

Large Specs short: +3623 contracts

Small Specs short: +1878 contracts

The speculators (those consistently wrong) continue to rotate away from long to short.

Commercials (banks) long: +2592 contracts

Commercials short: -6733 contracts

The commercials (those consistently right) are covering shorts to and some are even going long.

Now, chew on this for a moment. The dreaded and evil BoA puts out a report that warns of further U.S. credit downgrades before year-end.

Hmmm. Do you recall what happened from 8/7 to 9/6? How about a $250 gold rally, primarily caused by massive bank short-covering, all of it following the initial U.S. downgrade from S&P. Think of that CoT survey again. Could the banks be trying to front-run the next downgrade?

So, let's just go ahead and put it on the record: I'm expecting a 10% rally in gold before 12/1/11. This gives us a minimum target area of 1780-1840. Let's split the difference and call it 1810 or about 10% UP from where we stand this evening. That type of rally corresponds with where we are on the charts, too:

Soon, we will burst through the tough resistance around 1700 and begin mounting this assault on the backs of continued bank buying as well as the short-covering of the misguided specs. If December plays out similar to Decembers past, gold will then finish the year somewhere between 1750 and 1800, continuing the trend of 20-25% annual returns.

I wish I could be as enthusiastic about silver but I'm not. Though I still expect a stellar 2012, the remainder of 2011 will find silver continuing to struggle with high margins and a pit bully named JPM that doesn't appear ready to begin covering its massive short position just yet.

So, there you go. Once gold closes above 1705, my confidence in this forecast will grow considerably. At that point, I'll look to buy some Dec11 calls. Maybe buy some outright or spread some 1700s vs some 1800s. We'll see. I'll keep you posted.


9:50 am EDT UPDATE:

WOPR is in charge this morning as the PMs are being sold because of this headline:

Down goes euro. Up goes dollar. WOPR sees dollar up. WOPR sells gold and silver. Yawn.

Perhaps some human buying will emerge soon. At around 1630-35, the hourly chart holds the promise of a little reverse H&S bottom of off last week's test of support near 1600.

Hang in there and enjoy the ride. More later. TF

About the Author

turd [at] tfmetalsreport [dot] com ()


Oct 25, 2011 - 8:14pm

Stratego to a lesser extent

Sixty Israeli drones co-produced in Azerbaijan for Baku. Spy satellites next

DEBKAfile Special Report October 25, 2011, 2:20 PM (GMT+02:00)

Tags: Israel Azerbaijan drones Russia Turkey Iran Israeli missile-carrying UAV for Azerbaijan

Azerbaijan's election to a non-permanent seat on the UN Security Council brings to the world body for the next two years a government which has cultivated lively military and economic ties with Israel.
Those ties are constantly challenged by Turkey's military industries, giving Ankara yet another reason to scowl at Jerusalem. Russia, Armenia and Iran also view this collaboration with distrust, especially the rapid arming of the Azerbaijan army with assorted types of Israeli drones co-produced in new factories established in Azerbaijan.

Both Moscow and Tehran are actively looking for ways to torpedo this expanding military partnership...

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:17pm

Euro Zone "Grand Plan" Seen

Euro Zone "Grand Plan" Seen At Risk

"A meeting of European Union finance ministers ahead of a gathering of European leaders was canceled Tuesday, raising concerns that parts of the package to stem the region's debt crisis remain in doubt and a final agreement won't be reached at Wednesday's summit.

The finance ministers from all 27 E.U. countries were due to meet early Wednesday in Brussels to settle the final issues on a package of measures ahead of an evening gathering of E.U. leaders followed by a meeting of euro-zone heads of government.

After already pushing back the deadline for the anti-debt crisis package once last week, European officials had repeatedly pledged in recent days that Wednesday would be when they outlined the key measures. But a statement from the Polish E.U. presidency mid-afternoon, confirming the Ecofin gathering had been scrapped, signaled there was more work to be done before a deal is finalized.

"Further work at the level of ministers of finance will be conducted based on the outcome of the heads-of-state meeting. The aim is to adopt all necessary elements and details concerning the package, as promptly as possible," said the statement. "

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:19pm


Personally Ivars, I think providing your opinions (however you decide to present them) on TFs blog is useful and acceptable, as useful and acceptable as Shill's, Tesla's et al. Whtas not useful is mindless "No thinks not here" attitudes just becuase someone doesnt find something of interest. Its the collective knowledge on this blog that is most likely to help individuals make well researched decisions.

The Vet
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:20pm

The normal pattern..

for gold and silver trading over the past few weeks has been an immediate dip when trading resumes after the Globex shut down and then a gradual rise back up when Sydney opens, culminating in a sharp rise when Hong Kong opens. So far today it is following this pattern which is on very low volume until the Asian markets get into full swing.... Gold dipped to $1695 but is back to $1700 and silver down to $32.91 but is now back to $33.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:26pm

Welcome Wagon Forum

A hat tip to Moderator Jane.....nicely done.

Nice rush through Ag 33.80, and a stop for a coffee at 36 (as I recall). We'll soon see.

I'm curious about the situation in Italy. Banks tank, Gub'mint toast? I'm watching currencies tonite.

This train seems to be speeding up.

Best wishes to everybody. Peace.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:26pm

The clock is ticking...

Despots Beware

Victor Ndula


Oct 25, 2011 - 8:31pm

.M. Kitco Metals Roundup:

.M. Kitco Metals Roundup: Comex Gold Ends Sharply Higher On Strong Safe-Haven Demand Amid Fresh EU Uncertainty

25 October 2011, 2:12 p.m.
By Jim Wyckoff
Of Kitco News

(Kitco News) - Comex gold futures ended the U.S. day session sharply higher and hit a fresh four-week high. Strong safe-haven buying demand surfaced Tuesday as the market place quickly became disenchanted with the prospects of Wednesday's European Union leaders meeting producing any credible or concrete results on dealing with the EU debt and financial crisis. A suddenly canceled EU finance ministers meeting that was scheduled for Wednesday set off the fresh market place concerns. December gold last traded up $50.70 at $1,703.00 an ounce. Spot gold last traded up $48.40 an ounce at $1,702.25. December Comex silver last traded up $1.536 at $33.16 an ounce.

The market place at mid-morning turned from a “risk on” trading day to a “risk off” day when it was announced that the EU finance ministers meeting, scheduled for Wednesday, was cancelled. But gold benefitted on the sides of that equation—boosted by the generally rally in commodity markets early on and then boosted even more by the safe-haven demand when investor risk appetite soured on the fresh EU debt worries.

The EU summit meeting will still occur Wednesday, at which time many believe credible measures to deal with the crisis will still be implemented. We’ll see. Many market watchers are reading the situation with skepticism and rightfully so. The safe-haven gold market has and will likely continue to garner at least some underlying investment demand from the EU debt crisis, as we saw today.

Many market watchers perceive the EU bailout package and further measures to shore up the U.S. economy will amount to more quantitative easing by central banks (read that printing more money). This is one reason commodity markets, including precious metals, have seen price strength this week. When currency markets become over-inflated, hard assets like commodities come into more favor with investors.

The U.S. dollar index is traded firmer Tuesday, also on safe-haven buying. The dollar index remains in a short-term downtrend on the daily chart, however, and that’s an underlying bullish factor for the precious metals.

The London P.M. gold fixing was $1,656.00 versus the previous P.M. fixing of $1,652.00.

Technically, December gold futures prices closed nearer the session high Tuesday and hit a fresh four-week high. Bulls Tuesday gained fresh upside near-term technical momentum to re-establish a four-week-old uptrend on the daily bar chart. Prices also pushed right up to strong resistance at the August spike low of $1,705.40. A solid push above that level would likely set off fresh buy stop orders to push prices even higher. Bulls now have the near-term technical advantage. Bulls' next upside technical objective is to produce a close above solid technical resistance at $1,750.00. Bears' next near-term downside price objective is closing prices below psychological support at $1,600.00. First resistance is seen at $1,705.40 and then at $1,725.00. First support is seen at $1,675.00 and then at $1,650.00. Wyckoff's Market Rating: 6.0.

December silver futures prices closed nearer the session high Tuesday and hit a fresh four-week high as the bulls also gained fresh upside near-term technical momentum to re-establish a five-week-old uptrend on the daily bar chart. The silver bulls now have the overall near-term technical advantage. Silver bulls' next upside price objective is producing a close above strong technical resistance at $33.585 an ounce. The next downside price breakout objective for the bears is closing prices below solid technical support at last week’s low of $29.935. First resistance is seen at Tuesday’s high of $33.335 and then at $33.585. Next support is seen at $32.50 and then at $32.00. Wyckoff's Market Rating: 6.0.

December N.Y. copper closed down 330 points 341.60 cents Tuesday. Prices closed nearer the session low and did hit a fresh four-week high early on. The key “outside markets” were mostly bearish for copper Tuesday, including a firmer U.S. dollar index and lower U.S. stock market. Still, a bullish double-bottom reversal pattern may be forming on the daily bar chart. Copper bears still have the overall near-term technical advantage. Copper bulls' next upside breakout objective is pushing and closing prices above solid technical resistance at 370.00 cents. The next downside price breakout objective for the bears is closing prices below solid technical support 320.00 cents. First resistance is seen at 345.00 cents and then at 350.00 cents. First support is seen at Tuesday’s low of 335.80 cents and then at 330.00 cents. Wyckoff's Market Rating: 3.0.

Jack Eric Original
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:31pm

Primer on Financial Repression


Thanks for the excellent post on Financial Repression. I have digested all the links except the Reinhart paper which I will work on over the next several days. It all makes sense and for me seems to better explain some of the "whys" for the confusing moves made by the powers that manipulate the market. Understanding of the nominal GDP seems to be key as you have stated. I am going to try to use these ideas as a basis for unraveling the meaning behind the moves of the major players globally as they are unfolding. I am hopeful that it will help me to think outside the box of conspiracy, dollar vs. gold, EE vs. loyal turdites, etc. that seem to flood us all from the posts on this site.

Also, I want to thank you for all your posts, which have helped me to move up the learning curve in this complex yet important game. I look forward to any posts you send whether on mainstreet or in the forums.

Hopefully, I can add more to the threads. I have some ideas I am putting into writing on cycles based on ideas from Howe and Strauss (The Fourth Turning), info. I have read from the GATA website, and other sources.


Oct 25, 2011 - 8:31pm

Personally Ivars, I think

Personally Ivars, I think providing your opinions (however you decide to present them) on TFs blog is useful and acceptable, as useful and acceptable as Shill's, Tesla's et al. Whtas not useful is mindless "No thinks not here" attitudes just becuase someone doesnt find something of interest. Its the collective knowledge on this blog that is most likely to help individuals make well researched decisions.

Funny I thought I said this as well, but your version is better than mine.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:34pm
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:36pm

  Oct 20 (Reuters) - The

Oct 20 (Reuters) - The Russian central bank will continue raising the share of gold in its gold and foreign exchange reserves, the central bank First Deputy Chairman Alexei Ulyukayev said on Thursday. "We are not planning to step away from this path. We are acquiring huge volumes (of gold)," Ulyukayev told the parliament.

Housing Continues Its Death Spiral

This is a great Article.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:43pm

I appreciate Ivars' postings

I appreciate Ivars' postings but attention to this is beginning to border on the obsessional. Let's just read him in peace, and let those who don't want to, to move on. Surely this can't be that hard...

My suggestion to those who find his work interesting is to visit him on his blog as well. There he gives a fuller account of the reasoning that support his numerical representation of these ideas (yes, mathematical equations that are transformed into charts). His work is his about his ideas, the charts are just nice lines that depict them.

I'm sure if highschool math teachers ever described this subject matter in this way, we would have many more students stronger in this subject. Numbers are the mathematical equivalent to letters in a word. They are only symbolic representations, nothing else.

Rufanuf Shill
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:45pm

@Shill didn't. Or if that's what you mean it's not how its being received, hence the Hat Tips being received by those trying to point it out to you. Let people post their ideas HOWEVER they want to present them, and don't suggest the "suppression of opinions." regarding the future path of PM prices is without value, just becuase it is what YOU personally have decided. What would be a good idea is to suppress the posting of endless music posts....I don't think its what most readers come here for.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:45pm

Syrian news / SANA (Govt. controlled media outlook)

(DPH: I tried finding some Russian news and the same thing. Very sterile/emotionless imo)

Nasrallah: Syria Partner in Resistance Victories… President al-Assad Believes in Reforms

BEIRUT, (SANA)-Hezbollah Secretary General Hassan Nasrallah underlined that Syria is a partner in the victories of resistance movements in Lebanon, Palestine...Read more

Arab Figures Express Solidarity with Syria in Face of Foreign Conspiracies

DAMASCUS, BEIRUT, (SANA)-Participants in the meeting of the Executive Council and Secretariat-General of the Arab Vocational Federation for Municipality and Tourism Workers voiced support to Syria in face of the foreign conspiracy targeting its national and pan-Arab stances in support of the Arab causes and resistance...Read more

Kulaib: Weakening Syria's Role Serves Israel

DAMASCUS, (SANA)-Lebanese Strategic Researcher Sami Kulaib stressed that the Western project which aims at directing a blow against Syria and weakening its key role was blocked by the power and steadfastness of the Syrian diplomacy, limited demonstrations and ...Read more

Five Terrorists Confess to Smuggling Weapons, Working among Armed Groups and Committing Criminal Acts in Jisr al-Shughour, Lattakia and Abu Kamal

DAMASCUS, (SANA) - Terrorists Ala'a Ahmad Nanna and Walid Ahmad Nanna and confessed to joining armed terrorist groups in attacking the Military Security Detachment in Jisr al-Shughour in the northern province of and killing its personnel, in addition to smuggling firearms and ammo from Turkey...Read
Four Security Forces Martyrs Laid to Rest
DAMASCUS/ HOMS, (SANA)- Four security forces martyrs on Tuesday were escorted from Tishreen and Homs Military Hospitals to their final resting place in their villages and cities after they were targeted by the armed terrorist groups in Daraa and HomsRead more
Bobbejaan ¤
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:45pm

Angela Merkel expects tiny growth prospects

Angela Merkel, pictured with EC president Jose Manual Barroso & some other hypodermics, at the weekend's eurozone summit, where Angela Merkel appears to be discussing the size of the male members ... um ... Growth Prospects .................. Photo: EPA (Extreme Penis Anxiety).

Eric Original
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:46pm

Thanks Jack

Your check is in the mail!

No, seriously, I'm just glad I could help. That's what it's all about.

BTW, looking forward to some of that "Fourth Turning" stuff. Very interesting ideas there.

Rufanuf redwood
Oct 25, 2011 - 8:50pm


I agree with you Redwood, except the part about visiting his blog. On that basis shall we just do away with 90% of the posts here that just reproduce or point to someone else's work? This place has functioned very well as a one stops shop to get a lot of information from a lot of different sources. That's what I use it for, and I think that's what its creator would want (a successful blog). So being critical of anyone who wants to contribute meaningfully seems utterly beyond the spirit or purpose of this blog.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:51pm

Thanks for the video reminder rufus

I see myself as a huge fiery comet, a shooting star. Everyone stops, points up and gasps "Oh look at that!" Then whoosh, and I'm gone ... and they'll never see anything like it ever again -- and they won't be able to forget me, ever." James Douglas Morrison: December 08, 1943 -- July 03, 1971

Video unavailable

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:57pm

My take on Vaccines

I gree up when polio was still around. The Sabin vaccine was a miracle of modern medicine. Other's like small pox vaccines have been a great benefit to mankind. But from what I understand there is a great deal of difference between a single shot, single disease type of vaccine, and the multi-use concoctions like MMR. Polio was a scourge. Flu is an inconvenience. Thymerisol is an abomination.

Oct 25, 2011 - 8:58pm didn't. Or if you didn't. Or if you that's what you mean it's not how its being received, hence the Hat Tips being received by those trying to point it out to you. Let people post their ideas HOWEVER they want to present them, and don't suggest the "suppression of opinions." regarding the future path of PM prices is without value, just becuase it is what YOU personally have decided. What would be a good idea is to suppress the posting of endless music posts....I don't think its what most readers come here for.

Dude I am going to forewarn you right now, you don't want to go here trust me. Your entitled to your opinion, so be it. But if your going to corner me and call me out I am going to come back at you ten fold.

And it will get ugly...

Now you said your peace, and now Ill say mine..

In mathematics, a half iterate (sometimes called a functional square root) is a square root of a function with respect to the operation of function composition. In other words, a functional square root of a function g is a function f satisfying f(f(x)) = g(x) for all x. For example, f(x) = 2x2 is a functional square root of g(x) = 8x4.

One notation that expresses that f is a functional square root of g is f =

Hope this helped.

Rufanuf Shill
Oct 25, 2011 - 9:01pm

@ Shill

And your point is? Let people express their idea's Shill....what you need to say is "point taken".

Bay of Pigs
Oct 25, 2011 - 9:02pm

This is relevant

Ben Davies of Hinde Capital at the GATA Gold Rush 2011.

"Monkey Business -- Reality, Illusion, or Delusion"

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:03pm

Turd Humor

Today, my wife was sitting in the living room when she heard "Hello again folks, this is Turd", coming from the upstairs bedroom. Apparently my "little ones" had gotten ahold of the Ipod and happened upon his podcast. They thought it was hilarious (youthful innocence). They played it over and over, eventually inviting the neighbor kids over for a listen.

So, we're doing our part to educate the kids in the art/science of economics. Just keep the "turds" coming and they'll be hooked for life.

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:04pm

anecdotal evidence?

whats wrong with anecdotal evidence? if anything its a more innocent form of research. no vested interest, no corruption...i would believe what i experience or witness than something big corrupt pharma or blubbermint puts out, no? maybe it's just me. i tend to go not with politics... LIFE..I certainly never listen to or follow recommendation of critics of movies and restaurants and other self opining enjoyable moments..why would i give power to soem idiot that gets paid to critique something they have no idea my likes/dislikes?

sorry for the tangent...anyways..I have family members that were never vaccinated with anything....and you know what? they dont get sick. As for those that want to accept the medical protocol and their 'philosophy' of poke and pray...go ahead. Enjoy. know this..not one, thats right..not one medication or drug, OTC or Rx is absent side effects. I have read, researched and experienced the alternatives to 'modern medicine' and they work for my family and me.

Good luck!

r a

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:05pm


Get off it unless you actually want it to continue unabated. Point taken?

Rufanuf ¤
Oct 25, 2011 - 9:07pm


Point taken.

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:07pm


Yes, if a blog is successful it should be (largely) a one stop operation. What I am trying to communicate though is that Ivars' "charts" cannot be compared to our traditional charts, so to refer to them in this manner is misleading and simplistic.

As Ivars' himself stated he utilizes millions of bits of info to formulate his ideas that are then represented in graph form . So I only suggested it if anyone is interested in the ideas that are at play and which he constantly upgrades.

That's why to refer to this work as something that is a final product is ridiculous. It's a guide, and it will be reshaped with time and events. No different than what Turd or anybody else does. O.k. I will try and not say anymore on this matter. Let's just move on shall we?

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:10pm


You beat me to the punch....I appreciate your contributions as much as anybody else and I will no longer get in the way of this discussion.

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:11pm

Your assuming I care  RU, I

Your assuming I care RU, I don't. And my mental deficiency tells me I see a very well coordinated attack here by you and redwood. Little Pm action going on here to represent your fan club? Go back and read the thread. I said Ivars continue doing what you do m8 didn't I?

What is it with this major brick wall defense when someone criticizes Ivars, are you all a team in drag? Got a little partnership blog thing going pushing Ivars personal warped view of the future of Pms?

Like I said lets do this...

Ahh what I need to do is agree with you, Ah I see.

" What you need to say is Point taken "

That sir, will never happen, I can guarantee my membership here, that will not happen.

Oct 25, 2011 - 9:11pm

Kitco News w/ Daniela Cambone (Interview w/ Vince Lanci)

Who is Vince Lanci, you might ask. I put his info below, from Kitco, because
I hadn't heard of him. The "safe haven" topic seems to be all the buzz.
I got an email from APMEX, on a very similar theme to this video.

Vincent Lanci embarked on his career in Commodity trading 20 years ago as a marketmaker on the floor of the Nymex and Comex and Nybot Exchanges. In 2004 he served as GP for for CiS Energy LLC, a commodity derivatives fund specializing in Energy Options.

After a successful run there, he formed Echobay Partners in 2007, a venture capital group specializing in Exchange Vertical investments, FMX|Connect and Cameron Hanover among them. He currently oversees company strategy in trading as well as investing and is also actively managing a portfolio in precious metals for echobay.


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Key Economic Events Week of 5/20

5/20 7:00 pm ET CGP speech
5/21 10:00 ET Existing Home Sales
5/22 2:00 ET FOMC minutes
5/23 9:45 ET Markit PMIs
5/24 8:30 ET Durable Goods

Key Economic Events Week of 5/13

TWELVE Goon speeches through the week
5/14 8:30 ET Import Price Index
5/15 8:30 ET Retail Sales and Empire State Manu. Idx.
5/15 9:15 ET Cap. Ute. and Ind. Prod.
5/15 10:00 ET Business Inventories
5/16 10:00 ET Housing Starts and Philly Fed
5/17 10:00 ET Consumer Sentiment

Key Economic Events Week of 5/6

5/9 8:30 ET US Trade Deficit
5/9 8:30 ET Producer Price Index (PPI)
5/9 10:00 ET Wholesale Inventories
5/10 8:30 ET Consumer Price Index (CPI)

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