Is the U.S. government "murderous, bankrupt, parasitical, destructive (of free markets)"?

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stephanie
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Is the U.S. government "murderous, bankrupt, parasitical, destructive (of free markets)"?

To quote a comment from Velocity in the 4th of July blog comments, I'm setting up this topic so that those who want to discuss the U.S. government or "vent their spleen" about it may do so here. Please remember, however, the Community Guidelines still apply in this topic! That means: NO PERSONAL ATTACKS. Thank you!

Edited by admin on 11/08/2014 - 06:24
Monedas
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Velocity ?

We have lost our way ! The answer is not more Socialism.........it's more freedom and LOWER taxes, permanently, so people can plan their productive economic activity in a supportive environment ! All the best ! Monedas 2011 Happy Birthday to two friendly giants......USA and Canada !

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Endzeit
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Endzeit's comment @Velocity

@Velocity

How does it come you write i would defend the plutocratic system? 

I have explained, why a plutocratic system cannot function for the people: because the elected actors do not have the authority, but hidden forces behind the scenes have the real power.

Who wants to be held responsible for politics, that others dictate him? Answer: nobody.

Therefore this system produces politicians, that do not want to be held responsible. It's a system with a negative selection.

Positive selection is achieved, if AUTHORITY and RESPONSIBILITY are brought togehter (the one who says, what has to be done, is at the end held responsible for his politics; for this responsibility he receives the authority).

If you don't want authority, fine you already have a system with politics without authority, while the authority of the hidden forces and lobbies grows and grows. So good luck with your fight against evil authority, while the forces behind the scenes are happy about everyone, who doesn't understand that responsibility and authority must be brought together, to threaten their power.

Velocity
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Monedas

"The answer is not more Socialism.........it's more freedom and LOWER taxes, permanently, so people can plan their productive economic activity in a supportive environment!"

If you think i want more socialism you just don't know me! I'm a free market capitalist to every cell in my bod'

I agree 95% with your more freedom and lower taxes. I just go te whole 9 Yards to absolute freedom and zero taxes with the complete 100% removal of Govt. It is Govt that taxes and it is Govt, a monopoly institution and a parasite by total design, that is the enemy of freedom

Govt monopolises power, authority and central control. That is the exact enemy and opposite of distributed power, of individual power and self-determination.

How can you "plan a productive economy" when the Govt has awarded itself the power to rob your pockets (tax) with impunity (you have zero say in its tax rate changes)? 

Monopoly centralised power has never produced anything good in history and never will. It doesn't have to because it doesn't have to answer to anyone. Only competition gives consumers choice, with monopllies like Govt you're f**ked (which is precisely what it does to citizens)

 
 
stephanie
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Question for you, Velocity

First...Velocity, thank you for moving the discussion over to this thread. 

I had a question based on a previous comment of yours over on the blog. You mentioned the drug trade as something that runs well without an "authority." However, there's a vast difference between hippie pot growers living off-grid vs. the murderous drug cartels in Mexico who are slaughtering innocents in their attempts to corner the market. Some folks say that legalizing drugs will solve this problem...but would it really? And if we had no government at all, what would stop these guys from being violent? If violence makes them more profitable, what would stop sociopaths from using it in all areas of commerce? Would we revert to a feudal state system?

I happen to lean libertarian...I'm just wondering what the line is and what your response might be. Thank you.

Monedas
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We're on the same page !

That's the Libertarian ideal and something to work towards from now until eternity ! The problem right now it to pull up out of our death spiral without breaking the wings off ! A steam engine has a governor that prevents it from running away and blowing up ! We need to have a governor that when one party is too dominant and self dealing and begins to corrupt and entrench itself......it gets handicapped ! Unfortuneately, the people and the corrupt dominant party have to participate in the fine tuning of our checks and balances ! LOL Monedas 2011 Naptime for me ! See ya down the road !

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Velocity
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Ednzeit

Ok you want to bring power and responsibility together. Good cause. But you want this to be centralised in a single authority and/or person. I call that a monopoly. Let me explain why your system will never work in a million years:

1). you advocate a monopoly, centralised authority. It is a monopoly of power (decision making). Only the free market competition mechanism (CM) provides distirbuted power, between supplier and consumer. The CM is the simplest but most powerful force in capitalism because it allows constant decision making by the consumer plus constant innovation by the competing enterprises (otherwise they drop by the wayside) 

You invest your dreams and hopes in a single monopoly authority or person and first off you have no longer power to decide. Pretty dumb

Next you rest your personal decisions in an authority expecting them to represent you. Impossible. How is the single authority supposed to understand you and the other 20 milliojn people at the same time? An impossible task.

You want healthcare  in a yelow hospital with beef for lunch. Another consumer wants pink hospitals with fish for lunch. Is your politician ever going to find out what you want, and deliver it to you? Nope. Any authority dumbs down their product/service to usually single averaged products for simplicity

But competition (say 20 enterprises) will offer 20 options and say 4 options in that range (you have 80 options versus 1 from a single authority)

The most important point of the CM is you get choice (power), you get constant change in offerings and you get options if one supplier disappoints. If your monoply authority doesn't give you what you like you're f**ked (again!)

Tell me why would you ever want to rest your hopes, dreams or practical needs in some other person to "represent" who you are? Especially when that person/authority you are asking an impossible task, to represent millions of people (individuals) all of whom have different opinions? 

 
Velocity
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Stephanie

Good question and here's the answer/s (clear your mind and deal with facts and plain human behaviour, not the biggotry that Govt pumps out as propaganda to diss the trade ok)

What makes Mexican drug gangs violent? ....first reason is Govt is violent, their "War on Drugs". If Govt Police didn't tote guns in Swat Teams and seek out to oppress and jail these small businesses there would be a significant descaling of weaponary and an almost complete reduction in violence.

Secondly ask why 'gangs' are even involved rather than more mild types like small business people. Because again Govt has forced this business underground with its oppression and the only people that will deal with such Govt thuggery are thugs themselves. You reap what you  sow. If Govt chased drug dealers with petty fines of $50 rather than guns it'd be 'all change' within days

Regards Mexicos drug wars who ratcheted up the violence? Gangs will compete for turf (turf wars) as all animals do for prime position to customers or supply chains etc. So these fights are either between gangs or between gangs and gun toting police. Are the civil injuries because the Police are raiding during the day in built up areas and getting caught in the firefights?

An amazing fact is criminals do no harm their customer base. Govt will rob or piss on its taxpayers but criminals will not. Criminals are in business and deal with customers as all businesses do, they value them.

There's a lot of Police bollocks in Britain about shootings in Nottingham, the 'capital' of guns in England. But these are gangs fighting turf wars, they do not and have not to my knowledge harmed civilians (their customers)

Gangster Al Capone who ran illegal moonshine operations during Americas Prohibition again was no danger to the public. They were his customers. Govt is the only institution i know that beats up abuses and bullies its source of income. Far as i know the Otalian Mafia and Jamaican Gangs are also harmless to Joe Public  

Again regards drug wars in Mexico you've probably seen many films where criminals have politicians in their pockets. I find behind all legislation and persecutions by the State vested interests. sometime deemed criminal . It would not surprise me if the Police were under one direction of one of the competing drug gangs.

I read an article a couple months back of Mexican restaurants being raided (Jesus!) by the Health & Safety gistapo. I Googled it and low and behold there were a number of Mexican eateries being raided over a period of years, mainly prosecuting them for Mexican workers without complete work documents. Could a competing chain be driving these State raids?

Regards legalising drugs  de-scaling violence yes absolutely. There will always be dirty tricks and sometimes thuggery in any competing businesses (Big Oil?). thats human nature and nothing Govt has ever done will change that or will change that. In fact as we see Goct always increases violence around the world and locally. Govt is the biggest thug in history

Hope i've answered you ok, please fire back 

 
Endzeit
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Let's see, if we can get our

Let's see, if we can get our discussion going forward:

You say, you are a free market capitalist. You have a model of this system and you think, that society would be self organizing and doesn't need central planning in any form. Ok.

But have you ever thought about the fact, that market capitalism over time always leads to monopolization? So it's not a stable system. And even in the pure economical sphere, you need laws, that keep down the monopolistic behaviour of market participants.

Because the behaviour of market participants is not aimed torwards a functioning market - it is aimed at maximizing their profit. And how can profit be maximized? By monopolization. If you don't believe that, it wouldn't matter. The Rockefellers do believe that and act accordingly.

Therefore also every market economy needs laws, and therefore an authority, to protect it from turning into capitalism and in the next consequence into an oligopoly and then monopoly.

We need an authority that protects the system.

The same is true when it comes to politics:

People are not equal. Some are honest, some are liars. Some are lazy others are industriously. Some are dumb, some are intelligent.

Therefore it is necessary, that politics makes rules, that all these can live together without being in a permanent war with each other. But because people are different, it must be made sure, that everyone has to follow the rules. Those who follow the rules, must be protected from those, who do not want to follow the rules.

This alone should be enough to recognize, that antiauthoritarian societies are fictious. They have never and will never work, as soon as the diversity of the people reaches a certain level (or if resources become scarce).

So if we understand, that we need authorities for a functioning society, we should take a look, how and where functioning societies work. And we see, that it's much less a matter if it is a monarchy or a republic, or something else. Very similiar to company. It's not so important if it is a stock company or a limited company. What REALLY counts in a system, is, if authority and responsibility are united in the same person.

It doesn't work, if you are held responsible for staff decisions, if you don't have the authority to decide about the staff.

And so a political system can't work, that brings every few years a new leader to the top, but this leader is much weaker than the lobbies, that sponsored his election campaign. A leader, who has not the authority to lead can  not feel responsible too!

We only can feel responsible for things, if we have the authority for it. If we are just actors in a bad theatre, we play our roles to become elected, but nothing can change.

History has shown, that the US system was not capable, to keep the forces that rule today, down. Therefore it doesn't make sense imo, like many Americans dream about a day like today, to try to revive that old system. It already has proven to weak to withstand international high finance.

So our discussion should be aimed torwards the question, which process can make sure that the man or women that is put on top of the pyramide, can receive so much authority and be also held responsible (with nothing less than his life, ofcourse), that he/she has enough authority to remove the forces behind the scenes AND be removed from power in a constitutional process, after his/her time is up.

If this question can be answered, then in such a system most of the problems that seem so huge today, could be solved by a single good leader with adequate authority within months.

Velocity
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Endzeit

"market capitalism over time always leads to monopolization? So it's not a stable system."

100% incorrect. I hear this liberal propaganda time and again, but you should challenge this nonsense and look at practical reality. The truth is always the exact opposite of the propaganda you were to swallow (by Govt) to justify its parasitical destructive existence. The truth is the exact opposite of what Govt and politicians (the biggest liars in every society) tell you.

Take your lead from nature, look around you, capitalism is a product of man and we are first and formost animals. We absolutely mimic the life cycles and bahviour patterns of all animals and nature (how could it be anything else?).

So how does nature work? Take a forest. We have baby plants (seedlings), young plants (teenagers) thrusting up, we have middle aged and the dominent establishment, big mature trees in their prime plus aged trees, starting to wither, tire and some diseased. Looks like the human population yes?

Also looks like remarkably a free market.

Take airlines (European market, unfamiliar with the US). We have the established dominant players (national carriers) we have young-middle aged thrusting new entrants (EasyJet, Ryanair etc) and we have young babes emerging (GermanWings, Nikiair etc). 

Yes there is 'domination' they have fought their way up and enjoying their time in the sun. But as just happened in Europe young thrusting Ryanair, an amazingly price innovative low cost carrier and its milder version EasyJet are taking over the forest canopy. Ryanair has just usurped th previous diminance of the old national flag carriers to become Europes No.1. And one day Ryanair will be usurped by another rising younger carrier.

This is market competition (just as in a forest or a pack of wolves or a flock of birds or a shaol of fish). Constant churn, constant competition, constant change and vibrancy. No monopoly ever developes in a free market because of constant changes and constant competition by new young thrusting competitors.

Where do we find monoplies? Your 'protector' but in truth the actual protection racket that is Govt, in Govt regulated markets, strangled of true competition, change and market churn. In utilities such as oil we find vast global monopolies, old big fat diseased dinosaur oil Co's protected and propped up for decades. The truth of this statement in the fact of the lack of market churn. These bloated old protected beasts have dominated the forest canopy for decades with close to no new entrants entering th petrol market on your high street.

This is all the hallmarks of monoply practice. No innovation, no change of old guard to new guard. The real monoply markets are not free markets, they are Govt regulated markets the protection racket that supports monopolies.

If Oil was deregulated there would be an explosion of new young creative entrants who would nip these bloated old Govt protected monopoly Oil Co's to death in a matter of years. The establishment would wither defending its markets from attacks from all the new entrants, these monpolies would simply run out of money and energy

Take a look at any market you care to mention for the life cycle of young to old. Take music. New bands emerge and usurp the old ones (punk replaced metal, boy bands replaced punk, R&B replaced boys bands, House replaces R&B and HipHop etc)

Where do you see no market churn? All the Govt (over) regulated markets and yes the big bloated diseased dinosaurs of banking: Goldman Sachs (80yrs old), JPMorgan (10yrs old) etc and no new entrants in decades, same as oil, same as healthcare etc

The free (competitive) market would never allow such dinosaurs for long though some Co's life cycles are longer than others (like the Beatles lasting near 30 years whereas most top bands last 5-6 years, some 1 year or 1-hit-wonders). 

So free markets act like nature with lifecycles and constant competition. They do not alow any established player too long at the top whereas Govt strangled markets and Govt propped up monopolists do not change. This creates systemic weakness because they are not kept fit by constant competition. So what happens when problems hit?

Exactly what happened in 2008. All the big bloated dinosaur banks, protected by Govt, got wiped out. they all went bankrupt in 2008.

The worst systemic mistake is to put your eggs in a few big baskets. When you could put your eggs in 80 baskets. Try shooting 3 turkeys versus trying to kill 200 ants. You simply cannot eradicate small flexible and many. Much easier to take a few big targets, especially if they've spent years being protected by a big farmer (the Govt) and have got lazy fat and stupid through no competition

You want systemic stability: the free market wins

You want no big monopolies. the free market wins

From any angle (consumer choice, number of offerings, innovation, pace of change, quality, price, reliability etc) the free market and its constant competition wins hands down. No contest

 
 
Velocity
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Endzeit (Reply: Part II)

"..most of the problems that seem so huge today, could be solved by a single good leader with adequate authority within months."

You did not answer my last post and question regards why you want to put YOUR authority (power) into 1 person or body, like Govt, to decide what's best for you?

Your above sentence repeats your belief in a one true perfect system to solve "all the big problems". You appear to be looking for God. You also appear to be looking for leadership for your life (instead of believing in yourself capable of doing it) and an almost religous belief in some system of Govt.

The Chinese have a saying, "You do not have one big problem, but lots of small problems".

So answer my question, how do you expect one person/system to sort out your medical needs when I may want a completely different medical support through my life? How is one system going to respond to 2 different peoples needs?

I want to pay if and when my health is bad. You might want to pay an insurance premium all your life for cover at any time. How is your one system going to cater to both of us? How is your system going to cater to 120 of us?

Truth is it cannot. When a single system tries, like Govt, it spits out one standard product, take it or leave it. Your one system is too inflexible, too stupid, too unresponsive, too stretched to respond. It fails.

Repeat the Chinese saying, you have lots of small problems. There's your answer. You do not rest power or anything in one system. It cannot represent you and me and 120 other people. you leave it to flexible systems like the free market that will offer you 20 or 80 offerings. You as an individual can then pick your favourite. 

Everyone is happy, all 120 of us, instead of your one big system that pisses off 100 of 120 people.

Small, flexible and many beats a few big dinosaurs.

So addressing your want for one big authority to answer the big problems, break the big problems into smaller ones and find lots of small answers to each.

The answer for society is a self-governing society, freedom. Just like nature. A flock of birds does not have any one authority. They are individuals making their own decisions. they flock together at times when it suits them, and fly away when it suits them. Humans surpisingly can govern themselves just like birds, like the fish, like the Buffalo. We are afterall animals like them, we just happen to be even more intelligent my mutation of nature.

We can handle ourselves, just lie animals do without any central authority which as i've explained is completely inept at deciding for individuals what is best.

You do not have big global problems. They are not your problem.

You have your own small individual problems. Deal with them, not that fantasy of the globe.

Pretty soon you'll realise there are no big global problems. There's only you and your life to govern for yourself, the rest can take care of itself as you do. A self determined self sufficient society that like a flock of birds comes together at certain times (football matches etc) as a herd.

The world is entirely an individual experience. The collective, the society, is a fantasy of politicians and academics. to herd you but not to represent you because they simply cannot do it. They can never represent you or anyone else, these frauds can barely represent themselves.

So shove the worlds problems aside because the world will look after itself (i promise). Just like a free market the individual components are self adjusting and self sufficient so the world will sort itself out and you focus on your self and enjoy each day as it comes

 
 
Yooper Rick
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Velocity

This pretty picture you paint of free markets churning along unmolested by Banksters would be great but since they have a strangle hold on the entire Western World, markets as well as governments,seems a little "pie in the sky" doesn't it. I and many Americans would love to know how to rid ourselves of the "Fed", J.P. Morgan, Goldman Sachs, BofA, CITI Bank and all the rest of your Euro Bankster Mafia families' influence. Got any constructive ideas?

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gazkaz
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If 2 Americans tell 2 Americans -The Truth....

If 2 Americans tell 2 Americans -The Truth - a better world

Foghorn you are welcome, please share the information.

Anyone who missed it :-

The USA is a Corporation owned and run by the European Banksters (The Crown Corporation).

It becomes patently obvious to anyone who actually watches your Senate/congressional hearings into the FEDs activities. The FED evades or doesn't answer the questions, or the chairman allows them to just waffle until their time limit is up.

If that's not obvious, then ask why the Senate/Congress can't audit the FED, or audit what is said to be "your" Gold Reserves.

The FED Reserve is a private corporation, which if you track through all the corporations who own it, their cross share holdings, controlling interests etc, then ultimately you will find it is owned by.........the European Banksters (The Crown Corporation etc).

Hopefully even if you haven't read my links or watched the video in my earlier posts, the above illustrates the FED outranks your Government, and they are owned by the Banksters in Europe,  so hopefully you might re-visit the posts & links.

Why do you get involved in so many conflicts and who ultimately sanctions them - well it must be those who RANK top of the tree.

As the mother of the sons who run the Rothschild European Banking family said on her deathbed:-

“If my sons did not want war, there would be none”

http://www.analysis-news.com/allfolder/Understanding-II.htm

And also, if you read the above link, you will know why - they fund both sides (how much of your annual budget goes on the military ? - so nice profits too).

Don't shoot the messenger - start digging for the truth yourself; after all it's your country (well it "should" be)

- & hopefully you will tell 2 others who will tell two others :o)

gazkaz
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If (your choice) you want to

If (your choice) you want to get an insight into what happened to the U.S (the process)

Watch what happened to ICELAND

At the final hurdle of the Banksters process - i.e sign everything over to them, literally everything, the Icelanders told them to stick it where the sun don't shine, defaulted and KEPT THEIR COUNTRY.

The Greeks are at the same point now.

Unfortunately in 1933 the U.S signed everything over to their creditors (the Banksters)

- they still own it all.

http://www.barefootsworld.net/usfraud.html

Velocity
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Yooper -

Yooper, there is a mighty simple (constructive) answer to 90% of the problems of the Western monopolist dominated world of propped-up bankers, business monoplies and elite families that Govt is the specific tool designed to ratchet for these elites at the expense of wider (productive) society. 

The answer is very simple if you throw the liberal garbage we are propagandised into swallowing into the bin for a few minutes and look only at the mechanical, practical, factual wheels of society and how the wheels churn (and why they don't too).

What is the greatest power of Govt? Taxation. The power Govt and Royalty (elite families) have anointed themselves throughout history to live off the productive wealth (backs) of society.

Govts major asset is the ability to milk society, and that is a practical reality. Don't let the liberal (worthless) ideology rush into your brain just yet to object, lets just deal with this matter of fact. And all Govts additional power and assets are entirely built on that one income stream, it funds everything Govt does and all the vested interests (parasites) Govt dishes it out to to prop up (with your money).

So how do we bring down Govt easily, quickly, painlessly without blood in the streets and like Greece, months of futile protests? Simple: Govts greatest power (tax) is also it's greatest Achillies Heal.

All it takes to collapse Govt is for society (not all, just enough, say 4-6%) to stop paying taxes. To stop fueling parasites.

Govts entire edifice, all its other powers and might are funded by this one income stream to milk society. And just as sub-prime only required 4% of the crap mortgages to default to bring the entire system to its knees, it only requires 4-6% (my estimate) of society (citizens and small/medium sized business) to stop paying taxes and the entire unproductive, wealth sapping, sham of democratic Govt collapses too.

Govt hangs on this tenuous, ultra-fragile thread, to tax (rob) its people. On this income stream rests the only other source of Govt income, debt. If people (begin to) refuse paying taxes all creditors panic because it is the ability of Bush, Obumma, Timmay and Bernanke to tax society ahead for years that the entire debt load hangs on. Without Govts income stream from taxing society (its productive wealth) Govts ability to service and raise debt implodes in a matter of minutes (ok 2-3 weeks tops).

And what is fueling all these national and global monopolies (parasites living off the central parasite, Govt) such as dinosaur Oil Co's, dinosaur bankers, central bankers, such as the IMF, EU, such as Mastercard and Visa and lazy monoplist elite families? Our tax. Stop paying our taxes into the collecting point, Govt, and first Govt itself collapses and then all the monopolists that live off it implode in (very) short order thereafter. 100% Guaranteed.

So if you want to end the Fed and monopoly money? You want to end national and global oil and energy monopolies? You want to stop bailouts/propping-up crap bankers and an end to the big Wall Street fraudsters? You want to level the Rothchilds or the Bilderburg Group? End the welfare State, healthcare and funding other peoples lives off your own back? You want to stop murderous foreign wars? Bring down the military-industrial complex? Fed up that every politician there ever was was a liar and a fraud and you never want to see their lying faces again? Maybe you just want to keep your income and stop the criminal syndicate that thinks it can rob your pocket anytime it wants without any recourse whatsoever as I do?

The 'Revolution' could not be easier or simpler;

Stop paying tax.

Stop feeding the parasites.

Stop the monopolists robbing our pockets 

 
 
Velocity
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gazkaz - You Finance the Wars

As the mother of the sons who run the Rothschilds ...said on her deathbed, "If my sons did not want war, there would be none”

​There is a simpler way of stopping the Rothchilds and all these mindless murderous wars. Stop funding them (yes YOU fund them). 

The Rothchilds fund their wars through the taxpayer wealth robbed by the State to pay for all the hardware and all manpower for war. No taxpayers = no wars... they'd have to fund them out of their own pockets (and soon be bankrupt). As most Kings and Govts have found also so expensive which is why almost all taxes originated to raise money off society to fund these expensive and destructive acts of violence 

Just as the big monopolies are expensive to fund from their own pockets, such as banking, oil and military contractors themselves they are all totally dependent on Govt who is totally 100% dependent on the continued 'support' (stupidity and/or laziness and/or fear) of the taxpayer. Fact.

Zero Tax = Zero Govt

...zero Govt means zero wars, all of which are started by this monstrous social and economic monopoly of Govt. It cannot be simpler to bring this garbage to a neccessary end: Stop Paying Tax

 
 
 
Yooper Rick
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Velocity

Thank you for your answer. I was put off at first by the hatred of your posts on the main blog though not the content. I agree that not paying taxes would cripple Gov't. It's hard to say what their reaction would be but I would love to see it happen.

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Zero Govt.

Somalia has no government, if you don't consider tribes and gangs government.  Perhaps you should move there.  No taxes, nobody will make you buy license plates for your car.  Walk to the river to get your drinking water, hope to heck it's not polluted.  Hope nobody decides that your nice western clothes are worth killing you for.  I'm sure the lucky denizens of Somalia don't have problems with pollution and disease.  You don't have to worry

about your tax dollars supporting corruption, course someone may rob you and use the money to buy guns for their piracy venture.  Sounds like a paradise for you anarchists.

Wow, anarchy is so 1910.

Velocity
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Yooper

Yes i'm full of hate (a ball of frustration, annoyance, disgust and utter contempt) for Govt, a true vandal in society and across the globe. There's never been a good Govt in history because the nature of Govt is to suck (a parasite). Nothing good will ever come out of any monopoly institution, why should it, it's a monopoly?

This is why i'm looking for that 4-6% of taxpayers refusing to feed/endorse Govt. It should translate as about 3,000,000 taxpayers (based on 60m taxpayers actually being Net positives for the State, the rest are drains after handouts are deducted)

Because this number of protesting taxpayers will be too much for Govt to prosecute and try to bully and/or abuse. Another weakness of the State, it is only a handful of people versus the far larger mass of people.

The worst it could do is send letter after IRS letter to all tax protestors (so what?). Then it could Bailiffs or the usual thugs squads from the IRS. To 3m people??? They'd have their work cut-out for years to get around everyone.

So i hope of the many movements that evolve as recession turns to Depression, one includes a Zero Tax protest and/or online sign-up campaign. It'll be more effective than any other (the parasites of Govt will shit their pants at this protest because tax they are fully aware is their one geatest power to be taken away)

 
 
Velocity
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"Somalia has no Govt" Isreal

"Somalia has no Govt"

Isreal and Palestine HAVE Govts... and they've been 'at it' (just like Somalia) for 80 years? 80 years of non-stop conflict, killing and bickering brought to you by Govt

All global wars were started by Govts, what's your point about not having a Govt, does it disturb the 'peace' Gov brings to the world?!!

What improvement to anything do you claim Govt makes Einstein???

Somalians are fighting a turf war, one gang/tribe versus another. What do you think Govt would do, be peacemaker like in Isreal-Palestine?

Thailand also has 2 tribes 'at it'. Reason is neither tribe wants the other tribe to have the reigns of Govt, because they know it's a monopoly, and they know that if the other tribe gains Govt control they can use societies wealth (tax income) and the State bully squads (Police, army etc) to abuse, repress and via the Judiciary (crony Govt appointees) persecute and imprison the other tribe.

So how has "democratic Govt" done anything anywhere in the world to make matters better? All it's Laws it breaks (that is true anarchy). It lies, fabricates and then wages false murderous wars in foreign countries its own people have never been threatened by (see American invasions of Vietnem, Iraq, Afghanistan and now Libya - none have threatened the US. Fact).

Your beloved Govt appears to be a murderous thug out of control and not representing anyone in its own society (ie. quite insane). And every Govt in the Western world with few exceptions are right now irresponsibly dumb -arsed bankrupt. All of them are in the middle of or about to rob everyones pensions (responsible peoples financial management) because the politicians are so incompetent (see Obummas recent raid on US pensions to pay a shortfall due to his predictible socialist spending orgy)

What a fab institution you put your faith in. A violent warmonger, a thief, an idiot, a liar and cheat and a total bankrupt ...unlike me the "anarchist" who is self-sufficient, civil, takes care of himself and his friends. What a perverse inverted reality (delusion) you live in where you support mis-behaviour and call civil people "anarchists". You must be a thieving worthless politician yes?

 
 
 
SilverTree
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http://www.tfmetalsreport.com

http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/forum/1647/esf-and-its-history-must-watch

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