Historically Low Gold OI Levels
I was going to post this into the previous note but then decided that it needed it's own thread.
The Gold Comex is dying. As we speculated late last year (http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/blog/3120/thought-experiment), confidence in the fairness of the CME and Comex is leading investors and traders worldwide to exit the exchange. Growing awareness of the paper game manipulation is surely affecting things but, in my opinion, the biggest driver of this exodus is the failure of the CME Group to adequately backstop customer accounts following the collapse of MFG last October and PFG last month.
The proof is in the numbers so let's go back and review some so that we can look at this in the proper perspective.
3/21/09 - QE is just beginning as the world is stabilizing following the events of 2008. Total gold OI is 388,000.
12/30/09 - Gold ends the year near $1100 and the total OI has risen to 491,712.
11/11/10 - Gold is now $1400 and QE2 has just been announced. Total OI is now 644,738.
1/25/11 - We had the huge and strange story about a massive, deferred month hedge being taken off and total OI fell 81,000 contracts in one day to 499,000. Very strange.
4/8/11 - As silver is set to move to a peak, total gold OI is back up to 514,000.
8/19/11 - Speculation in gold is rising after the S&P downgrade of the U.S. However, banks are looking to cover short positions even faster. Total OI is near 521,000.
12/30/11 - After being ruthlessly crushed from Labor Day to New Year's Day, total gold OI ends the year at 422,070.
2/28/12 - After a 2-month rally in price, total gold OI peaks at 479,044.
And now, here we are. As of Friday, August 3rd, the total OI for gold is just 389,679. The lowest total OI for 2012, down nearly 20% since late February, and the lowest total OI since The Great Financial Collapse of Autumn 2008.
For a change, I'm not going to tell you what I think this means. I want to hear what you think it means.
One more thing, silver OI remains nearly constant in this timeframe. It peaked near 150,000 back in early April of 2011 and has bottomed near 100,000 on several occasions. Curiously, since 6/28/12, the total silver OI has been in a tight, 3000-contract range between 121,ooo and 124,000, never once closing above or below those levels. Then on Friday, as gold OI sank to its lowest level of the year, the total silver OI broke out of this pattern to close at 124,503. Huh?
Anyway, maybe this is much ado over nothing but I find it all very intriguing. I look forward to reading your thoughts in the comments below.
TF
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Comments
So What
IMHO, I don't think these OI numbers mean much. I've been thinking about the person who posted recently about losing a lot of money in PMs the past year. I look at different sites that talk about "being prepared". I am starting to think that too many folks on this site aren't going to be prepared.......as in not prepared for a disappointing couple of months to follow in PMs. Over the past couple of months I've seen dozens of posts on here concerning different world or local events, some accurate some not, that supposedly will somehow, someway contribute to an economic collapse. Of course, nothing usually comes of these "incidents". Too often, when people have a vested interest in an outcome, they see what they want to see. And with most people on this board having a vested interest in the value of PMs, getting caught up in "what may happen" becomes too easy. I could take the time to lay out a couple of scenarios that could happen that would increase the value of the USD. Congress and this President can do a couple of things to increase employment across the country. And yes, believe it or not, there may not be an all out war involving the United States, Israel and Iran in the next couple of months. There may come a day when the Fed raises interest rates and we know what impact that would have on the price of PMs. No one can be certain what the future holds, especially the immediate future. To those who are somewhat new on this site....be smart. Don't put all your eggs (maybe not even half) in one basket. Don't deny yourself the opportunity to enjoy your life, you only live once (I think). Just one person's opinion.
@pbreed...
My thoughts also, but doesn't it seem sort of, well, "early" for there to be a collapse in the paper trade @ COMEX? I agree the end game will leave the dealers standing around the crap tables at the casino with no customers to fleece, but I'd expect the exit of the willing masses to be somehow .... noiser.
I assume the vix is
I assume the vix is manipulated too. It doesn't act like it is supposed to act and it hasn't for at least a year. Just another Wall Street "product" which looks like it would be useful but it in fact only exists to screw the masses.
Brokerage firm implosion whenever large delivery month
Is anyone starting to notice that we get a commodity brokerage firm implosion whenever there is a large delivery month in Gold and/or Silver?
October 2011 Gold - MF Global
July 2012 Silver - Peregrine Financial Group
August 2012 Gold - Knight Capital
Just sayin...
PEACE
Black Swan - Spotted!
On zerohedge, here, breaking.
Reuters story is here.
Gas prices in the Golden (soon to be toxic-soot covered) State are going to skyrocket.
Can you say emergency and disaster area? Can you say federal bailout? Can you say watch Obummer on the nightly news in his hazmat suit promising to rebuild everything?
Game changer, folks, for real.
@Cal Lawyer
Obama deserves his GWB-after-911 moment too. Total whores who exploit tragedy and suffering for gain...
Low O.I. levels vs Obama's reelection?
Has anyone considered the remote possibility that perhaps the banks and corporations that rule the world don't want Obama reelected?
Could that also be the reason why therefore no new QE has (yet!) been announced?
Could that be a reason for these low O.I. levels?
Getting tired of the old re-runs...
"the lowest total OI since The Great Financial Collapse of Autumn 2008"
So the charts look similar, the OI is similar and financial firms are failing left, right and center... Hello, 2008, how have you been?
Virus threat
@adrock
http://www.nadirmetal.com.tr/
>>>>
My Anti-virus s/w is reporting a virus threat from this site....
Re: Swedish Chef
A lot of the goldbugs ALSO think that this time it will be different and that a deflation in asset prices will actually see a rise in PM prices. Well...it won't!
King World News has been cheerleading the goldbugs for nearly half a year now, with a continuous hype about "an imminent explosion in prices" and all of this is predicted by "veterans" and "legendary traders," narrated by a guy who sounds like he smoked half the year's production of Colombia's finest grass. Riiiight.....
I'm long gold/silver, but at the moment I have lot's of cash stuffed away in a private vault. I'll buy more PM's when they get thrown out with everything else when the stock markets take a nosedive.
I've been 'buying the dips" for years now, and I've NEVER seen a shortage or a lack of supply! Not today, not last year during the silver spike to $49,-, not during last year's gold spike to $1900,- and not during the major sell off in 2008.
Oh, but wait? Lemme guess: this time it's different right?
Emails: Geithner, Treasury
Emails: Geithner, Treasury drove cutoff of non-union Delphi workers’ pensions
http://dailycaller.com/2012/08/07/emails-geithner-treasury-drove-cutoff-...
kudos to TF- Steer's @ Casey
Bullion banks shedding shorts ahead of price explosion, Turd Ferguson says
Interviewed for GoldMoney by the economist Alasdair Macleod, gold and silver market letter writer Turd Ferguson remarks that recent declines in gold and silver have been manufactured to help relieve bullion banks of their short positions, a development he thinks will soon will lead to an explosion in prices.
While recommending continuing acquisition of the monetary metals -- real metal in hand -- Ferguson warns against short-term trading in the metals because their markets are so manipulated.
Ferguson believes that "the great Keynesian experiment" in fiat money is ending and will be replaced with some form of gold backing for currencies. I borrowed this headline and the introduction from a GATA release on Saturday. The interview is 27 minutes long and is posted in audio format at the goldmoney.com Internet site here.
media blackout on ca fire?
is there another media blackout for the cvx fire in richmond ca?
cnn, msnbc, nbc, fox .... no coverage, zero zip.
zerohedge + presstv + rt ... has lots of info on it.
Is it just me?
Or has the number of shills, trolls and disinfo spewers gone up around here lately?
Re: Puck T. Smith
Disinformation? Trolls? Where? I don't see (m)any here.
For a change, I'm not going to tell you what I think this means. I want to hear what you think it means.
What I see here is a healthy discussion about Turd's original question about the drop in O.I. which I quoted above. If you don't like to hear any contrarian views then you perhaps also better stick to KWN where there's no interaction, no messaging board and just plain old PM cheerleading from the usual suspects.
@fulgerite
Could be this time is different, but if not, that point in time will arrive. Better to be a year early than a minute late.
@fulgerite
Could be this time is different, but if not, that point in time will arrive. Better to be a year early than a minute late.
Sorry for hitting it twice . . .
Quote:Better to be a year
Well, yes and no. I don't see the reason to rush into PM's, instead steadily accumulate them and take advantage of the weak handed longs that sell their PM's at the first sign of trouble.
For months we've been hearing that 'some sort of system meltdown is imminent,' and although I'm definitely not denying that there are major systemic problems, I doubt that an all out collapse is in the cards.
I live in Berlin Germany and I recently watches a documentary on German TV about the first couple of weeks in May 1945 of life in Berlin after the surrender of Nazi Germany. This comes closest to a systemic collapse as one can think; the city has been reduced to a pile of rubble, no food supply, a currency that has collapsed, no infrastructure, NOTHING! Not even Gold or PM's weren't going to help you in those days, the best 'currencies' were food, cigarettes, fuel clothes etc. Cigarettes, vegetables, potatoes or a couple of kilos of meat would have probably bought you a shedload of Gold in those days!
A similar, but not as dramatic, scenario unfolded in the early 1990's in the Soviet Union when communism collapsed.
Another interesting example is the unification of East and West Germany and the controlled systemic collapse of DDR. In that case it actually paid off to keep your (relatively worthless) East German Marks in your bank account, as they were swapped 1:1 for the strong Deutsch Mark. Could such a controlled collapse happen again when Germany perhaps decides to leave the Euro and introduces a New Deutsch Mark? How will PM's fare in such a scenario?
There s a lotta ins, lotta outs, lotta what-have-you's (to quote The Big Lebowski) and PM's are not always the answer.
The reason why I like PM's is because they are a long term and portable store of wealth. Just like a Jew living in Germany in the 1930's, holding PM's allows you to leave/escape a political and economic system and start somewhere new, either way before, or a few months after a systemic collapse.
How Bout This...Part Deaux
More funny money made available to the TBTF Banks to play their reindeer games with...and the market rockets higher!!! Go figure...
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/sp-above-1400-fed-conducts-second-600-million-repo-following-nearly-4-year-hiatus
This should get them through the end of the federal fiscal year (Sept). But only by using their "MF Global approved" 40X leverage in the derivatives market of course.
Fulgurite: That is totally
Fulgurite:
That is totally incorrect. LAST TIME was different. 2008-9 saw some deflation and a crash in gold and silver. However, in the past, 100% of deflationary phenomena have been in terms of gold, when on a true gold standard, and the price of gold has RISEN in the market when gold was not exchangeable at the Treasury window or at banks. 2008-9 was a very short term move, as we have seen. Sell your silver now, and you might not be able to get it back.
Also, bullshit you didn't see a shortage in 2008. LCSs everywhere were completely out, and all the online retailers had huge delays. I had to wait THREE MONTHS to get delivery on the big order I placed after the crash. Not only that, but I had to pay a 50% premium over spot! Ever since that time, premiums have become a way of life. prior to 2008, you paid maybe 50 cents over spot for a 1oz round, where today you are paying at least three dollars. You used to be able to get junk silver for well UNDER spot. I haven't been able to find it without a premium for a couple of years now, and was damn lucky to get it without premium when I did.
Agent Ivens
Remember the strange story of FBI agent Ivens who approached a Russian diplomat and spoke of a terrorist attack on US soil. He said "they are all insane" and fled from Burbank to the Verdugo mountains. An FBI manhunt ensued fearing he was suicidal.
Very curious.
Well, he was found dead near his home with a gunshot to the head.
http://www.sacbee.com/2012/08/06/4699433/coroner-burbank-fbi-agents-death.html
The coroner has ruled suicide.
See - the FBI knows best. Now go back to your regular programming - nothing to see here.
So it does go.
Did I strike a nerve?
I'm just a simple stacker who also has pretty good handle on basic economics. Perhaps I'm just thick, but everything I've read--haven't been to KWN for months--says silver is being consumed faster than it is being produced. Heck, even the USGS says silver will be the first element to go extinct. It doesn't matter if it goes to a $1.50 in the sort term. Until someone comes up with some new engineered material that beats silver's electrical conductivity, heat transmission and reflective properties--at a price comparable to silver--silver is going up. If that makes me a permabull or a cheerleader so be it.
I don't pay a lot of attention to the trader talk because it is not relevant to me except as an interesting sideshow.
Re: tmosley
Huh, what do you mean with "incorrect?" I've been saying all along that when asset prices deflate, then PM's go down with them.
Well, it might be new(s) to you, but the world is bigger than just the USA. In the fall of 2008 and beginning of 2009 I bought Gold in Germany (at my local Sparkasse) and also in the duty free store on Dubai Airport. Supply was abundant, and yes, it's real gold as I had it checked. Like I said, in 2011 after reading all sorts of stories online about supply shortages, I checked with my local store here in Berlin (www.proaurum.de) and both silver and gold were readily available during the shark rise to $49,- and $1900,- respectively.
50% over spot? Dude, you're getting ripped off, but it must be a US thing. Whenever I travel to the US for business, I always check and see if there are any good deals available, but the premiums are just ridiculous.
Just a thought
I’m not too bright when it comes to technical analysis – which is why I come here for my advice from Turd and the Turdites. I admit I did not thoroughly read every post so I’m sorry if someone already mentioned this. Just a thought – is it possible that this lengthy stretch of gold and silver trading in a tight range and basically going nowhere for months has frustrated many small speculators to the point that they are out of the market waiting for a trend… and TPTB know this and the insiders – banks, funds, etc – are going to jump in all at once and position themselves Long at these lows? The little guys will miss the boat initially, and possibly prompt margin hikes will prevent some from getting onboard.
I’m still thinking that a breakout can only be up from here, and the atmosphere seems like this sideways trading is coming to an end soon.
I suppose another possibility is that TPTB will keep the small speculators out by making it look like gold and silver are going nowhere… but slowly inch the price up a few dollars/cents at a time.
Mostly wishful thinking, I admit.
I bet it thoroughly irritates TPTB that people like us will be fine when they bring down the currency.
You claimed that gold bugs
You claimed that gold bugs think "this time will be different", when historical precedent tells us exactly what happens to gold and silver prices during economic collapse. 2008 was "different" in that there was a partial collapse accompanied by liquidation of paper gold and silver. Claiming that that is now somehow the norm in the face of hundreds of years of fiat-physical history is just ignorant.
Perhaps you have heard of the Perth Mint? They deliver something like 6% of the world's gold. Don't know how much silver. 6 month delays in 2008 from them. Stop trying to change the subject to other times. We are talking about 2008 here. Further, just because your country doesn't have problems with supply doesn't mean the rest of the world doesn't. Yes, there are arbitrages available. So what? That doesn't mean there aren't serious supply problems. Just because you can buy a sack of flour doesn't mean the wheat supply isn't down. Further, Europe has a big VAT tax on silver, IIRC, something which makes it much, MUCH less attractive there than it is elsewhere. Not a lot of people claiming that gold is in short supply.
And nice job conflating 50% premiums in 2008 with current premiums. 2008 is not the same year as 2012 in a lot of ways.
Quote:Stop trying to change
Hmm...yeah right!
2012 IMF advisor warns about a Worldwide Banking Meltdown
http://geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/2012/08/2012-imf-advisor-warns-...
IMF advisor says we face a Worldwide Banking Meltdown : They will keep printing euros and dollars until everyone realized they are printing euros and dollars.Euro and dollar has to default because these debts are too high anyway. Establish a gold standard and start developing real means of production again so we can turn into a producing Libertarian economy, instead of a consuming Keynesian economy.The banking system has been hijacked by greedy psychopaths, but they are making many errors in there way because the truth is surfacing and more people are becoming aware of corruption and greed. the Babylonian system is coming down. the crisis was created by banks, benefits only banks and its ruining people's lives in the name of supposed economy and under this crisis governments create outrageous laws for terrorism, for telephones surveillance, cameras on the streets and other staff that deprive us our rights The day or reckoning is coming before the end of the year if not before the end of this month...you all better be prepared with gold guns food and a getaway plan somewhere safe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q1LjaDA1olU
10 year at 1.63%, yields were
10 year at 1.63%, yields were just under 1.4% a few weeks ago.
Brent oil now over $111, this is before any major QE, what happens after the ECB and Fed crank it up?
@tyberious
That was October 2011.
YOU implied that I am
YOU implied that I am currently paying a 50% premium, when I said I paid a 50% premium in 2008. You keep talking about 2011 and other times when the time in question is 2008.
Keep this up and I will put you on my ignore list.